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From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>
To: Joseph Garvin <joseph.h.garvin@gmail.com>
Cc: ndame@protonmail.com, stefan@marxist.se, rms@gnu.org,
	drew.adams@oracle.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org
Subject: Re: "Why is emacs so square?"
Date: Thu, 16 Apr 2020 18:42:30 +0300	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <83eesne8t5.fsf@gnu.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CAH=MJ4Yu0_ZLzm-W1-+i4JNh0PLSdNUGOxrzCkPjwtZ55EDEyg@mail.gmail.com> (message from Joseph Garvin on Thu, 16 Apr 2020 10:34:24 -0500)

> From: Joseph Garvin <joseph.h.garvin@gmail.com>
> Date: Thu, 16 Apr 2020 10:34:24 -0500
> Cc: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>, rms@gnu.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org, stefan@marxist.se, 
> 	ndame@protonmail.com
> 
> I think part of the problem with things like the menu bar is that if you're using emacs at all you are
> demonstrating a willingness to tolerate:
> 
> * A UI that doesn't look or behave like any other application
> * Keyboard shortcuts inconsistent with every other application
> * A bizarre ancient vocabulary inconsistent with every other application. e.g. no Microsoft word user has ever
> considered themselves to have opened a "buffer". They open "files". They move "windows" around, not
> "frames." They cut and paste not kill and yank, etc.
> 
> You are basically making a commitment to being or becoming a power user. I certainly would not have put
> up with it if I didn't think it was going to save me a lot of time as a software developer (and it does, everyday).
> I doubt anyone invests the mental effort to deal with learning emacs nowadays unless this is their goal. If you
> just want to do "casual" text editing emacs is a very weird choice in 2020.

That's definitely something we should keep in mind, but what on earth
does it have to do with turning off the GUI elements of the Emacs UI?
Or with the advice to newbies to turn them off?

> If you're a new user the idea that seeing kill and yank in the menu bar as options helps discoverablity doesn't
> really hold when already nothing is named the way you expect or acts the way you expect. If you're an
> experienced user, then I would guess that like me C-h f,v,k and blog posts are 99% of your discoverablity
> experience.

I suggest to take a good look at the menu bar, since we don't have
Kill and Yank there for a long time.  We have Cut and Copy and Paste
instead.



  reply	other threads:[~2020-04-16 15:42 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 577+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
     [not found] <<8wXYP4GY9hwW-9mYv6_LGMETZ8Vz3Ob1Bec6yh6kPT7yxjTkxA3V6dXY4ELra9tYiJUxJmgXKSIEX4w8HFiPRoeGVSQHDSoBVy1voj1e3Qo=@protonmail.com>
     [not found] ` <<E1jOYIC-000709-3J@fencepost.gnu.org>
     [not found]   ` <<CADwFkmnyYPjLd8=N7K955v5+34+wgDAUrC6C6KGG0xvT3OJr9g@mail.gmail.com>
     [not found]     ` <<E1jOuIG-0004CF-OB@fencepost.gnu.org>
     [not found]       ` <<83y2qwdmnd.fsf@gnu.org>
2020-04-16 14:58         ` "Why is emacs so square?" Drew Adams
2020-04-16 15:34           ` Joseph Garvin
2020-04-16 15:42             ` Eli Zaretskii [this message]
2020-04-16 18:29             ` Marcin Borkowski
2020-04-17 22:05             ` Ahmed Khanzada
2020-04-18  6:47               ` martin rudalics
2020-04-18  7:07                 ` ndame
2020-04-18 23:02               ` Stefan Kangas
2020-04-18 23:13                 ` Ahmed Khanzada
2020-04-19  0:42                   ` Po Lu
2020-04-19  2:10                     ` Ahmed Khanzada
2020-04-19  2:28                       ` Po Lu
2020-04-19  4:48                     ` ndame
2020-04-19  5:37                       ` Po Lu
2020-04-19  5:43                         ` Po Lu
2020-04-19 12:59                           ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-19 22:53                             ` Po Lu
2020-04-19 23:34                               ` Bob Newell
2020-04-20  4:34                                 ` Po Lu
2020-04-20  5:12                                   ` Jean-Christophe Helary
2020-04-21  1:47                                 ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-19 23:39                               ` Jean-Christophe Helary
2020-04-20  0:12                                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-20  4:35                                   ` Po Lu
2020-04-20 13:27                                     ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-21  8:48                                       ` Po Lu
2020-04-24  9:10                                   ` Stefan Kangas
2020-04-24 15:48                                     ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-24 16:31                                       ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-27 12:30                                       ` Improved welcome screen Stefan Kangas
2020-04-27 17:58                                         ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-27 19:07                                           ` Stefan Kangas
2020-04-27 19:13                                             ` Yuan Fu
2020-04-27 19:32                                               ` Stefan Kangas
2020-04-28  2:49                                             ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-28  7:19                                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-28  9:49                                                 ` Michael Albinus
2020-04-28 12:32                                                   ` Stefan Kangas
2020-04-28 13:08                                                     ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-27 18:39                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-27 18:48                                           ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-27 19:32                                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-27 21:29                                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-28  6:36                                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-28  7:59                                                   ` Stefan Kangas
2020-04-28 13:20                                                   ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-28 18:28                                                     ` chad
2020-04-28 23:14                                                       ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-29  3:28                                                       ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-27 18:49                                           ` Stefan Kangas
2020-04-27 20:02                                         ` Stefan Monnier
2020-04-27 20:35                                           ` Juri Linkov
2020-04-28 12:12                                         ` Nicolas Petton
2020-04-28 12:34                                           ` Stefan Kangas
2020-05-10 19:22                                         ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-10 21:26                                           ` Yuan Fu
2020-05-11 13:24                                           ` Arthur Miller
2020-05-11 22:59                                           ` Stefan Kangas
2020-05-12  0:03                                             ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-12  6:55                                               ` Colin Baxter
2020-05-14  5:04                                           ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-20  2:19                             ` "Why is emacs so square?" Richard Stallman
2020-04-20  3:07                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-20  5:07                                 ` Bob Newell
2020-04-20 13:49                                   ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-15 19:27                                   ` Steinar Bang
2020-06-04  3:26                                     ` Richard Stallman
2020-06-04  9:16                                       ` Arthur Miller
2020-06-04 21:50                                         ` Juri Linkov
2020-06-05 16:37                                           ` Tomas Hlavaty
2020-06-06 23:30                                             ` Juri Linkov
2020-06-07  0:33                                               ` Jean-Christophe Helary
2020-06-07 10:16                                                 ` Tomas Hlavaty
2020-06-07  3:53                                               ` Drew Adams
2020-06-07  7:51                                               ` Yuri Khan
2020-06-07  9:10                                                 ` Yuri Khan
2020-06-08  3:31                                                 ` Richard Stallman
2020-06-07 11:59                                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-06-07 15:32                                                 ` Drew Adams
2020-06-07 22:31                                                 ` Juri Linkov
2020-06-07 18:19                                               ` Stefan Monnier
2020-06-07 18:26                                                 ` Basil L. Contovounesios
2020-06-07 22:31                                                 ` Juri Linkov
2020-06-07 23:24                                                   ` andres.ramirez
2020-06-07 23:24                                                   ` Jean-Christophe Helary
2020-06-10 12:43                                               ` Tab-bar autoclose question Ergus
2020-06-10 21:55                                                 ` Juri Linkov
2020-07-11  9:50                                                   ` Ergus
2020-07-12  0:08                                                     ` Juri Linkov
2020-06-05  3:12                                         ` "Why is emacs so square?" Richard Stallman
2020-06-05 10:48                                           ` Marcin Borkowski
2020-06-06  3:57                                             ` Richard Stallman
2020-06-06 13:44                                               ` Arthur Miller
2020-06-07  3:37                                                 ` Richard Stallman
2020-06-07 14:52                                                   ` Arthur Miller
2020-06-05 13:01                                           ` Arthur Miller
2020-06-05 14:00                                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-05 14:57                                               ` Arthur Miller
2020-06-05 15:10                                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-05 16:15                                                   ` Tomas Hlavaty
2020-06-05 17:32                                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-06 12:49                                                       ` Tomas Hlavaty
2020-06-06  3:56                                             ` Richard Stallman
2020-06-06  6:55                                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-05 15:27                                           ` Bob Newell
2020-06-05 21:54                                       ` Tomas Hlavaty
2020-06-06  4:07                                         ` Richard Stallman
2020-06-06  6:35                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-07  8:03                                           ` Tomas Hlavaty
2020-06-07 14:21                                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-07 21:57                                               ` Tomas Hlavaty
2020-06-07 22:03                                                 ` Drew Adams
2020-06-08  5:41                                                   ` Tomas Hlavaty
2020-06-08  3:31                                             ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-21  1:51                                 ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-21  7:01                                   ` Joost Kremers
2020-04-22  3:17                                     ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-22  9:12                                       ` Nicolas Goaziou
2020-04-22 14:25                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-23  2:36                                           ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-23  8:41                                             ` Joost Kremers
2020-04-23 15:02                                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-24  6:36                                                 ` Joost Kremers
2020-04-24 10:14                                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-24 10:28                                                     ` Stefan Kangas
2020-04-24 11:14                                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-05-15 19:41                                                         ` Steinar Bang
2020-04-24 10:36                                                     ` Joost Kremers
2020-04-24 11:17                                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-17  3:36                                                     ` Ricardo Wurmus
2020-06-17  3:46                                                       ` Arthur Miller
2020-04-24  2:37                                               ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-24  8:47                                                 ` Joost Kremers
2020-04-24  9:59                                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-24 11:25                                                   ` Robert Pluim
2020-04-25  3:35                                                   ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-23 14:43                                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-24  2:43                                               ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-24 10:03                                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-24 11:34                                                   ` Robert Pluim
2020-04-24 12:09                                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-24 12:23                                                       ` Robert Pluim
2020-04-24 12:32                                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-24 12:39                                                           ` Robert Pluim
2020-04-23 12:33                                           ` Po Lu
2020-04-23  2:32                                       ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-20  4:48                               ` Po Lu
2020-04-19  6:32                         ` 조성빈
2020-04-19  6:39                           ` Po Lu
2020-04-19  6:41                             ` Po Lu
2020-04-19  7:04                             ` 조성빈
2020-04-19  7:13                               ` Po Lu
2020-04-19  7:45                                 ` 조성빈
2020-04-19  7:55                                   ` Po Lu
2020-04-19  7:59                                     ` ndame
2020-04-19  8:14                                       ` Po Lu
2020-04-19  8:16                                         ` ndame
2020-04-19 12:07                                     ` 조성빈
2020-04-19 12:16                                       ` Po Lu
2020-04-20  2:19                                         ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-20  4:30                                           ` Po Lu
2020-04-21  1:50                                             ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-21  2:11                                               ` Po Lu
2020-04-22  3:19                                                 ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-22  4:36                                                   ` Po Lu
2020-04-22 17:00                                                     ` Stefan Monnier
2020-04-23 12:27                                                       ` Po Lu
2020-04-23 15:23                                                         ` Stefan Monnier
2020-04-26  4:13                                                           ` Po Lu
2020-04-24  2:34                                                     ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-24  2:50                                                       ` Eduardo Ochs
2020-04-24  9:13                                                       ` Kévin Le Gouguec
2020-04-25  3:36                                                         ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-25  6:46                                                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-26  3:24                                                             ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-24  9:55                                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-19  6:52                         ` ndame
2020-04-19 13:29                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-19  2:18               ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-19  2:33                 ` Po Lu
2020-04-19  3:05                   ` Jean-Christophe Helary
2020-04-19  3:38                     ` Po Lu
2020-04-19  4:55                   ` ndame
2020-04-19  6:14                     ` Making Emacs more friendly to newcomers (was: "Why is emacs so square?") Po Lu
2020-04-19  6:54                       ` Eduardo Ochs
2020-04-19  7:22                         ` Making Emacs more friendly to newcomers Po Lu
2020-04-19  8:05                       ` Making Emacs more friendly to newcomers (was: "Why is emacs so square?") 조성빈
2020-04-19  8:12                         ` ndame
2020-04-19  8:21                           ` Making Emacs more friendly to newcomers Po Lu
2020-04-19  8:25                             ` ndame
2020-04-19  9:30                               ` Po Lu
2020-04-19 22:44                               ` Sébastien Gendre
2020-04-20  0:36                                 ` Stefan Kangas
2020-04-20  3:32                                   ` Tim Cross
2020-04-20  9:54                                     ` Po Lu
2020-04-20 13:50                                       ` Stefan Monnier
2020-04-21  8:52                                         ` Po Lu
2020-04-21 13:57                                         ` Simen Heggestøyl
2020-04-21 15:36                                           ` Yuan Fu
2020-04-22  3:14                                             ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-22  4:33                                             ` Po Lu
2020-04-23  6:33                                               ` Ahmed Khanzada
2020-04-23 10:14                                                 ` Stefan Kangas
2020-04-23 14:55                                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-23 17:07                                                   ` Why are so many great packages not trying to get included in GNU Emacs? WAS: " Stefan Kangas
2020-04-23 23:45                                                     ` Jean-Christophe Helary
2020-04-24  0:51                                                       ` chad
2020-04-24  2:02                                                         ` Jean-Christophe Helary
2020-04-24  9:02                                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-24  5:26                                                     ` Po Lu
2020-04-25 15:31                                                     ` Stefan Kangas
2020-04-26 11:57                                                       ` Jean-Christophe Helary
2020-04-26 12:17                                                         ` Stephen Berman
2020-04-26 12:52                                                           ` Jean-Christophe Helary
2020-06-13 11:59                                                     ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-13 12:50                                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-13 13:41                                                         ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-13 14:16                                                         ` Alan Third
2020-06-13 14:19                                                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-13 14:23                                                             ` Alan Third
2020-06-13 14:33                                                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-13 14:57                                                                 ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-13 15:02                                                                 ` Alan Third
2020-06-13 15:08                                                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-13 15:05                                                                 ` Andreas Schwab
2020-06-13 15:10                                                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-13 15:18                                                                     ` Andreas Schwab
2020-06-14 22:11                                                                       ` git-send-email (was: Why are so many great packages not trying to get included in GNU Emacs?) Kévin Le Gouguec
2020-06-15  2:37                                                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-15  6:59                                                                           ` git-send-email Andreas Schwab
2020-06-15  8:12                                                                             ` git-send-email Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-15  9:10                                                                               ` git-send-email Andreas Schwab
2020-06-15 13:22                                                                                 ` git-send-email Alfred M. Szmidt
2020-06-15 14:07                                                                                   ` git-send-email Andreas Schwab
2020-06-15 14:15                                                                                     ` git-send-email Alfred M. Szmidt
2020-06-15 14:16                                                                                       ` git-send-email Andreas Schwab
2020-06-15 14:25                                                                                         ` git-send-email Alfred M. Szmidt
2020-06-15  8:23                                                                           ` git-send-email Kévin Le Gouguec
2020-06-15 14:42                                                                             ` git-send-email Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-15 15:38                                                                               ` git-send-email Kévin Le Gouguec
2020-06-15 17:12                                                                                 ` git-send-email Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-15 17:59                                                                                   ` git-send-email Kévin Le Gouguec
2020-06-15 18:08                                                                                     ` git-send-email Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-15 18:51                                                                                       ` git-send-email Paul Eggert
2020-06-15 18:59                                                                                         ` git-send-email Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-15 19:06                                                                                           ` git-send-email Paul Eggert
2020-06-22 10:17                                                                                       ` git-send-email Kévin Le Gouguec
2020-06-13 14:35                                                       ` Why are so many great packages not trying to get included in GNU Emacs? WAS: Re: Making Emacs more friendly to newcomers Dmitry Gutov
2020-06-13 19:23                                                         ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-13 19:31                                                           ` Basil L. Contovounesios
2020-06-13 20:24                                                             ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-13 20:30                                                               ` Basil L. Contovounesios
2020-06-13 20:52                                                                 ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-13 21:00                                                                   ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-13 21:24                                                                   ` Basil L. Contovounesios
2020-06-13 19:33                                                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-13 22:09                                                           ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-06-13 23:00                                                             ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-13 23:23                                                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-06-14 10:00                                                                 ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-13 19:38                                                         ` João Távora
2020-06-13 20:30                                                           ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-14 10:41                                                             ` João Távora
2020-06-18 17:49                                                               ` Ricardo Wurmus
2020-06-18 22:34                                                                 ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-19 11:48                                                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-20 13:07                                                                     ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-20 14:02                                                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-20 15:41                                                                         ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-20 16:10                                                                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-20 18:04                                                                             ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-20 18:43                                                                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-20 21:31                                                                                 ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-20 22:25                                                                                   ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-21  2:35                                                                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-21  5:08                                                                                       ` Stefan Monnier
2020-06-21  8:58                                                                                         ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-21  9:00                                                                                       ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-21  1:37                                                                                   ` Yuan Fu
2020-06-21 13:49                                                                                   ` João Távora
2020-06-21 15:36                                                                                     ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-20 20:57                                                                               ` Ricardo Wurmus
2020-06-20 21:35                                                                                 ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-06-17  3:58                                                       ` Ricardo Wurmus
2020-06-17  8:58                                                         ` Konstantin Kharlamov
2020-04-20  4:53                                 ` Po Lu
2020-04-20  6:08                                   ` 조성빈
2020-04-20  9:53                                     ` Po Lu
2020-04-20 13:07                                       ` 조성빈
2020-04-20 15:32                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-21  2:06                                         ` Po Lu
2020-04-21  2:17                                           ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-21  4:42                                             ` Po Lu
2020-04-21 13:55                                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-22  3:14                                                 ` How to poll the users Richard Stallman
2020-04-24  4:31                                                   ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-25  3:37                                                     ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-25  4:09                                                       ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-25 15:35                                                         ` Drew Adams
2020-04-25 15:44                                                           ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-25 16:15                                                             ` Stefan Kangas
2020-04-25 16:46                                                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-26 15:25                                                                 ` Stefan Kangas
2020-04-26 16:22                                                                   ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-27  2:18                                                               ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-25 16:20                                                             ` Drew Adams
2020-04-25 16:29                                                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-25 16:54                                                             ` Drew Adams
2020-04-25 16:57                                                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-25 17:16                                                                 ` Drew Adams
2020-04-25 15:36                                                         ` Drew Adams
2020-04-26  3:25                                                         ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-26 14:21                                                           ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-26  3:25                                                         ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-26 13:23                                                           ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-27  2:19                                                             ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-27  2:30                                                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-26 16:56                                                           ` Drew Adams
2020-04-26 17:27                                                             ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-26 17:44                                                               ` Drew Adams
2020-04-26 18:35                                                                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-27  2:22                                                                 ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-27  2:22                                                                 ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-27  2:42                                                                   ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-27  2:22                                                                 ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-28  2:44                                                                   ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-28  3:12                                                                     ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-27  2:22                                                             ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-27  3:18                                                               ` Drew Adams
2020-04-28  3:06                                                                 ` Sacha Chua
2020-04-22  4:41                                                 ` Making Emacs more friendly to newcomers Po Lu
2020-04-22  8:13                                                   ` Sergey Organov
2020-04-22  3:19                                             ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-22 11:33                                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-23  7:04                                             ` Ahmed Khanzada
2020-04-23 14:20                                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-23 14:56                                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-23 15:32                                                 ` Yuan Fu
2020-04-27 16:09                                                 ` Arthur Miller
2020-04-27 16:43                                                   ` Jean-Christophe Helary
2020-04-20 14:22                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-21 12:43                                   ` Sébastien Gendre
2020-04-21 14:38                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-22  1:35                                       ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-22  3:26                                         ` Stefan Monnier
2020-04-30  7:49                                           ` "Themes" shipping configuration - an unusual convention Stefan Kangas
2020-04-30 12:21                                             ` Stefan Monnier
2020-04-30 14:48                                             ` Drew Adams
2020-06-13 16:30                                             ` Basil L. Contovounesios
2020-04-22 13:22                                         ` Making Emacs more friendly to newcomers Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-22 17:46                                           ` chad
2020-04-22 22:52                                             ` Yuan Fu
2020-04-23  0:12                                               ` chad
2020-04-23  0:49                                                 ` Yuan Fu
2020-04-22 17:55                                           ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-19 13:35                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-19 19:14                               ` Drew Adams
2020-04-19 22:50                               ` Po Lu
2020-04-19  8:16                         ` Po Lu
2020-04-19 23:50                   ` "Why is emacs so square?" Stefan Kangas
2020-04-19  2:19             ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-16 15:42           ` Jean-Christophe Helary
2020-04-16 16:33             ` Drew Adams
2020-04-19  2:19             ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-26 17:09 Jeff Norden
2020-05-26 23:17 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-29 14:27 ` Arthur Miller
2020-07-13 22:36 ` Jeff Norden
2020-07-13 23:37   ` Jeff Norden
     [not found] <<ae2588b0-c9ab-4c29-88e4-d1c6be5dfe94@default>
     [not found] ` <<CADwFkm=Vashc18sr=+h8XEdLAKa38U94jsnzc+TgABWFx0uQ9g@mail.gmail.com>
     [not found]   ` <<86blno9yle.wl-me@enzu.ru>
     [not found]     ` <<87d0845msg.fsf@yahoo.com>
     [not found]       ` <<WmYeBCfn8tubMj5iVHxMgGKmSC7hMl8ss713cEgHTq6o45pqJpQ5oRvZST_R4eRCfu3RENgyWVH4v2F4DK8P67GqjtnPbjnNRwFMRBrv2W0=@protonmail.com>
     [not found]         ` <<87h7xgjasw.fsf@yahoo.com>
     [not found]           ` <<0B01B576-3DC7-4FAE-8010-C9B5CB6BA024@icloud.com>
     [not found]             ` <<87d084htcf.fsf@yahoo.com>
     [not found]               ` <<149F5B4D-F219-409C-A994-096C777259EC@icloud.com>
     [not found]                 ` <<87v9lweynz.fsf@yahoo.com>
     [not found]                   ` <<74B639DD-3775-4BE7-B0B2-300B5CE62E14@icloud.com>
     [not found]                     ` <<87k12bewpq.fsf@yahoo.com>
     [not found]                       ` <<F9E49F3D-778C-4D40-93BB-F96F2027F72E@icloud.com>
     [not found]                         ` <<87o8rnacxr.fsf@yahoo.com>
     [not found]                           ` <<E1jQM1n-0007pM-KG@fencepost.gnu.org>
     [not found]                             ` <<877dyaye21.fsf@yahoo.com>
     [not found]                               ` <<E1jQi3e-0003b0-45@fencepost.gnu.org>
     [not found]                                 ` <<87blnlbnba.fsf@yahoo.com>
     [not found]                                   ` <<E1jR5v6-0002Ju-FR@fencepost.gnu.org>
     [not found]                                     ` <<87v9lsqgqw.fsf@yahoo.com>
     [not found]                                       ` <<E1jRoAd-0006LQ-TS@fencepost.gnu.org>
     [not found]                                         ` <<87eesdfdpv.fsf@gmail.com>
     [not found]                                           ` <<E1jSBbn-0003eo-Vf@fencepost.gnu.org>
     [not found]                                             ` <<83v9lo83kz.fsf@gnu.org>
2020-04-25 15:42                                               ` Drew Adams
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2020-04-24 16:38 ndame
2020-04-24 17:57 ` 조성빈
2020-04-24 18:02   ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-24 18:10   ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-24 18:28     ` Drew Adams
2020-04-24 18:42       ` chad
2020-04-24 18:53         ` ndame
2020-04-24 19:25           ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-24 22:52             ` chad
2020-04-25  7:12               ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-24 19:08         ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-24 19:22         ` ndame
2020-04-24 19:30           ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-24 18:40     ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-24 19:22       ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-24 21:57         ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-25 16:28   ` ndame
2020-04-25 20:45     ` Yuan Fu
2020-04-26 23:15       ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-26  3:20   ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-16 11:16 ndame
2020-04-16 11:24 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-15  4:49 ndame
2020-04-14 15:06 ndame
2020-04-15  3:00 ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-15  4:33   ` ndame
2020-04-15  4:39   ` Stefan Kangas
2020-04-15  4:54     ` ndame
2020-04-15  4:56     ` Emanuel Berg via Emacs development discussions.
2020-04-16  2:30     ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-16  5:28       ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-16 16:27         ` Clément Pit-Claudel
2020-04-16 18:26           ` Marcin Borkowski
2020-04-16 18:40             ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-16 18:54             ` Drew Adams
2020-04-16 17:32         ` Bob Newell
2020-05-14  2:32         ` Stefan Kangas
2020-05-14 15:53           ` Drew Adams
2020-04-16  5:02     ` Jorge Javier Araya Navarro
2020-04-16 21:31     ` Juri Linkov
2020-04-15  6:27   ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-15 14:17     ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-15 14:31       ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-15 16:34         ` Ulrich Mueller
2020-04-16 10:14           ` Alex Bennée
2020-04-16 10:22             ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-16 16:26               ` Closing displays GTK+ bug (was: "Why is emacs so square?") Ulrich Mueller
2020-04-16 16:36                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-17  2:25                   ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-17  9:20                     ` Closing displays GTK+ bug Ulrich Mueller
2020-04-18  2:07                       ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-16 20:36                 ` Log out hanging after X-forwarded emacsclient [Was: Closing displays GTK+ bug] Adam Sjøgren via "Emacs development discussions.
2020-04-16 21:57                   ` James Cloos
2020-04-17 16:06                     ` Adam Sjøgren via "Emacs development discussions.
2020-04-18  9:45                       ` Robert Pluim
2020-04-18 17:20                         ` Adam Sjøgren via "Emacs development discussions.
2020-04-19 13:13                           ` Robert Pluim
2020-05-10 10:11                   ` Log out hanging after X-forwarded emacsclient Adam Sjøgren via "Emacs development discussions.
2020-05-12  6:57                     ` long-standing GTK bug (was: Log out hanging after X-forwarded emacsclient) andres.ramirez
2020-05-12  7:57                       ` long-standing GTK bug Adam Sjøgren via "Emacs development discussions.
2020-05-17 11:40                         ` Adam Sjøgren via "Emacs development discussions.
2020-05-17 22:05                           ` Adam Porter
2020-06-09  2:37                           ` Richard Stallman
2020-06-09 14:32                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-06-10  0:53                               ` Richard Stallman
2020-06-10 14:33                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2021-05-08 11:51                                   ` Adam Sjøgren
2021-05-09 10:27                                     ` Robert Pluim
2021-05-09 15:11                                       ` Adam Sjøgren
2021-05-10  9:16                                         ` Robert Pluim
2021-05-10 10:00                                           ` Adam Sjøgren
2021-05-10 12:50                                             ` Robert Pluim
2021-05-10 13:10                                               ` Adam Sjøgren
2021-05-10 14:13                                                 ` Óscar Fuentes
2021-05-10 14:40                                                   ` Stefan Monnier
2021-05-10 14:45                                                     ` Robert Pluim
2021-05-10 15:00                                                       ` Stefan Monnier
2021-05-11  9:09                                                         ` Robert Pluim
2021-05-10  2:23                                     ` 황병희
2022-03-01 21:23                           ` Adam Sjøgren
2022-03-02 14:12                             ` Po Lu
2022-03-03  6:55                               ` Madhu
2022-03-03  7:21                                 ` Po Lu
2022-03-03  9:43                                   ` Madhu
2022-03-03 10:11                                     ` Po Lu
2022-03-03 12:06                                       ` Madhu
2022-03-03 13:05                                         ` Po Lu
2022-03-03 15:31                                           ` Madhu
2022-03-03 13:22                                         ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2022-03-03 13:30                                           ` Po Lu
2022-03-04 15:21                                             ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2024-04-09  5:07                   ` Log out hanging after X-forwarded emacsclient Thomas Fitzsimmons
2020-04-16 23:23               ` "Why is emacs so square?" chad
2020-04-18  2:03                 ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-18  7:06                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-20 22:14                   ` chad
2020-04-21  8:43                     ` Po Lu
2020-04-21  8:44                       ` Po Lu
2020-04-15 17:15         ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-15 20:08           ` chad
2020-04-15 20:44             ` ndame
2020-04-16  5:06               ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-16  6:00                 ` ndame
2020-04-16 14:26                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-16 15:52                     ` ndame
2020-04-16 16:25                       ` ndame
2020-04-17  2:25                       ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-16 19:14                     ` ndame
2020-04-16 19:26                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-16 19:33                         ` ndame
2020-04-16 20:04                         ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-16 20:30                           ` ndame
2020-04-17  7:06                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-17  7:28                               ` Jean-Christophe Helary
2020-04-17 10:00                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-21 23:54                                   ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-22 13:21                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-22 14:05                                       ` Clément Pit-Claudel
2020-04-22 14:29                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-22 15:17                                           ` Clément Pit-Claudel
2020-04-24  3:25                                             ` message-mode toolbars, was: " Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-30  4:27                                               ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2020-04-30 18:26                                                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-30 18:44                                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-30 23:57                                                     ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-01  6:18                                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-30 22:16                                                   ` Lars Ingebrigtsen
2020-04-30 22:44                                                     ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-11  1:37                                                     ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-22 16:14                                           ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-22 16:55                                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-22 17:04                                               ` Clément Pit-Claudel
2020-04-22 17:06                                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-22 17:19                                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-22 17:34                                                   ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-22 18:09                                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-22 18:07                                                   ` chad
2020-04-22 18:24                                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-22 18:45                                                       ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-23  9:42                                                 ` Stefan Kangas
2020-04-23 15:04                                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-23 21:46                                                     ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-23 20:36                                                   ` Alan Third
2020-04-23 17:10                                               ` Juan José García-Ripoll
2020-04-22 17:32                                             ` chad
2020-04-22 16:16                                           ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-22 16:22                                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-22 16:29                                             ` Robert Pluim
2020-04-22 18:02                                               ` Iñigo Serna
2020-04-22 18:05                                                 ` Robert Pluim
2020-04-23 12:36                                       ` Po Lu
2020-04-17  7:36                               ` Stefan Kangas
2020-04-17  9:51                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-17  8:50                               ` ndame
2020-04-17  9:59                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-17 16:08                                   ` ndame
2020-04-18  2:04                                     ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-18  9:53                                       ` Robert Pluim
2020-04-18 16:20                                         ` ndame
2020-04-19  6:02                                           ` Improving icons shipped with Emacs (was: "Why is emacs so square?") Po Lu
2020-04-19  6:52                                             ` Improving icons shipped with Emacs Po Lu
2020-04-19  7:04                                             ` Improving icons shipped with Emacs (was: "Why is emacs so square?") ndame
2020-04-19  7:06                                               ` Improving icons shipped with Emacs Po Lu
2020-04-19  7:14                                                 ` ndame
2020-04-19  7:20                                                   ` Po Lu
2020-04-19  7:56                                                     ` ndame
2020-04-19  7:58                                                       ` Po Lu
2020-04-19  2:20                                         ` "Why is emacs so square?" Richard Stallman
2020-04-19  2:33                                           ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-19 13:20                                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-20  2:18                                             ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-20 14:55                                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-21  1:52                                                 ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-21  4:40                                                   ` ndame
2020-04-22  3:17                                                     ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-18  2:04                             ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-15 22:11       ` Bob Newell
2020-04-15  3:35 ` Bob Newell
2020-04-15  3:44   ` Jean-Christophe Helary
2020-04-15  6:28   ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-15 13:57     ` Tim Cross
2020-04-15 14:09       ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-16 17:03         ` Clément Pit-Claudel
2020-04-16 17:22           ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-16 18:11             ` Clément Pit-Claudel
2020-04-16 18:21               ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-16 19:51                 ` Clément Pit-Claudel
2020-04-16 19:52                 ` Clément Pit-Claudel
2020-04-17  7:09                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-17 13:43                     ` Stefan Monnier
2020-04-17 14:13                     ` Clément Pit-Claudel
2020-04-17 14:46                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-17 15:27                         ` Clément Pit-Claudel
2020-04-17 15:38                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-17 15:52                             ` Clément Pit-Claudel
2020-04-17 17:16                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-17 17:40                                 ` Clément Pit-Claudel
2020-04-17 17:45                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-17 17:57                                     ` Clément Pit-Claudel
2020-04-17 18:36                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-17 18:51                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-17 19:31                                           ` Clément Pit-Claudel
2020-04-17 20:14                                             ` Stefan Monnier
2020-04-17 20:57                                               ` Clément Pit-Claudel
2020-04-15 14:11       ` Andreas Schwab
2020-04-15  4:14 ` Emanuel Berg via Emacs development discussions.
2020-04-15 22:09 ` Christopher Lemmer Webber

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