From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: GnuTLS for W32 Date: Thu, 05 Jan 2012 20:11:44 +0200 Message-ID: <83d3ayow7z.fsf@gnu.org> References: <83boqkr9bp.fsf@gnu.org> <874nwcu17i.fsf@wanadoo.es> <834nwcr6un.fsf@gnu.org> <87vcosskhc.fsf@wanadoo.es> <831urgr2yr.fsf@gnu.org> <87r4zgsh2w.fsf@wanadoo.es> <87ipks3zbo.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <87boqk3q69.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <87aa634st8.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <87fwfvsgfv.fsf@wanadoo.es> <877h17scdo.fsf@wanadoo.es> <87hb0b77nr.fsf@lifelogs.com> <8739bvs27m.fsf@wanadoo.es> <83k457p3fg.fsf@gnu.org> <87pqezqeph.fsf@wanadoo.es> <87wr96p4ab.fsf@wanadoo.es> Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: QUOTED-PRINTABLE X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1325787244 31352 80.91.229.12 (5 Jan 2012 18:14:04 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 5 Jan 2012 18:14:04 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: =?iso-8859-1?Q?=D3scar?= Fuentes Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Jan 05 19:14:01 2012 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([140.186.70.17]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Rirp9-0008Tf-Ll for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 05 Jan 2012 19:13:59 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:56030 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Rirp9-0006WK-6q for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 05 Jan 2012 13:13:59 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.92]:38364) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Rirp6-0006W1-2m for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 05 Jan 2012 13:13:57 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Rirp4-0001vL-SD for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 05 Jan 2012 13:13:56 -0500 Original-Received: from mtaout21.012.net.il ([80.179.55.169]:39783) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Rirp4-0001v6-F7 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 05 Jan 2012 13:13:54 -0500 Original-Received: from conversion-daemon.a-mtaout21.012.net.il by a-mtaout21.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) id <0LXC009007OGNJ00@a-mtaout21.012.net.il> for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 05 Jan 2012 20:13:51 +0200 (IST) Original-Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([77.127.16.185]) by a-mtaout21.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) with ESMTPA id <0LXC009DB7YZE9B0@a-mtaout21.012.net.il>; Thu, 05 Jan 2012 20:13:50 +0200 (IST) In-reply-to: <87wr96p4ab.fsf@wanadoo.es> X-012-Sender: halo1@inter.net.il X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Solaris 10 (beta) X-Received-From: 80.179.55.169 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:147352 Archived-At: > From: =D3scar Fuentes > Date: Thu, 05 Jan 2012 16:17:12 +0100 >=20 > Eli Zaretskii writes: >=20 > [snip] >=20 > >> I could say that your real-world experience distributing, instal= ling > >> and supporting software across heterogenous environments looks q= uite > >> limited, but I'll rather suppose that you were very lucky so far= . > > > > You can call 7 years of safe use on 4 different machines luck if = you > > want. I call it discipline and following safe practices. >=20 > Wait a minute. You are basing the points you so vehemently defend o= n > just personal experience with your own machines? Does that make sen= se at > all? Do you think that people is so disciplined and knowledgeable (= and > lucky!) as you and that makes all the problems you don't have to be= come > irrelevant for Emacs? Most "people" do not install multiple packages, such as MinGW and MSYS, that could potentially conflict on the same machine. And yes, I think my experience is fairly common to those who do. > That last paragraph of yours speaks tons about our different stance= s on > this issue. It is my direct responsability to keep my software up a= nd > running for hundreds of users across dozens of sites and configurat= ions > on machines I don't control, quite a few of them playing a critical > role, and deal with bug reports from tens of thousands of users > more. Does that involve installing MinGW and MSYS/Cygwin on the same machine? Or mixing MSVC 6 with MSVC 13? > Acting as if the experience I gather from my desktop were enough > to set the bar for the rest of world would be so foolish I never set that this bar is for everyone. For the umpteenth time: B= Y DEFAULT THE DLLS SHOULD GO TO THE SAME DIRECTORY AS EMACS.EXE. Let g= o!