From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Have you all gone crazy? Was: On being web-friendly and why info must die Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2014 05:57:00 +0200 Message-ID: <83a92fow6r.fsf@gnu.org> References: <87388bnzha.fsf@newcastle.ac.uk> <87k31mdbhe.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <87tx0qiv45.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <87h9wqd3i5.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <87fvc8kdsp.fsf@gnu.org> <6e11cd85-09a0-4b7a-baa2-0c810bdebbce@default> <871tnsg0w7.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <834msoqrsg.fsf@gnu.org> <87k31ki3tc.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <83zjafpu3b.fsf@gnu.org> <87d27b5hu0.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1419307069 19272 80.91.229.3 (23 Dec 2014 03:57:49 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2014 03:57:49 +0000 (UTC) Cc: lennart.borgman@gmail.com, adatgyujto@gmail.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: "Stephen J. Turnbull" Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Dec 23 04:57:38 2014 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1Y3GbI-0006lh-SO for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 23 Dec 2014 04:57:37 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:42966 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Y3GbI-00076p-F2 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 22 Dec 2014 22:57:36 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:47121) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Y3Gb2-00076i-7h for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 22 Dec 2014 22:57:25 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Y3Gax-00085u-2s for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 22 Dec 2014 22:57:20 -0500 Original-Received: from mtaout20.012.net.il ([80.179.55.166]:51184) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1Y3Gaw-00085o-R2 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 22 Dec 2014 22:57:15 -0500 Original-Received: from conversion-daemon.a-mtaout20.012.net.il by a-mtaout20.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) id <0NH000I00NNVI200@a-mtaout20.012.net.il> for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 23 Dec 2014 05:57:12 +0200 (IST) Original-Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([87.69.4.28]) by a-mtaout20.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) with ESMTPA id <0NH000IGYOBCIQ10@a-mtaout20.012.net.il>; Tue, 23 Dec 2014 05:57:12 +0200 (IST) In-reply-to: <87d27b5hu0.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> X-012-Sender: halo1@inter.net.il X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Solaris 10 X-Received-From: 80.179.55.166 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:180531 Archived-At: > From: "Stephen J. Turnbull" > Cc: lennart.borgman@gmail.com, > adatgyujto@gmail.com, > emacs-devel@gnu.org > Date: Tue, 23 Dec 2014 09:29:43 +0900 > > Eli Zaretskii writes: > > > > (But not in this case. I get completely > > > different results, oriented to very different audiences. > > > > By contrast, the above simple use of 'i' puts me _exactly_ where I > > want to be. > > But Eli, unless you've got a psychological condition I haven't > noticed, you are at most one of those audiences. And even if you > didn't write that node and indexing markup, you could have, no? Of > course you're not surprised! That's hardly a fair test. > > Don't get me wrong: I have always been happy with the results of "i", > 80% or 90% of the time it does indeed take me exactly where I want to > be, and much of the rest of the time I end up in some unintended place > that is nevertheless educational (and usefully so). But I also did > the whole tutorial the first time I used Emacs, and often get started > with a new program by reading a few chapters in sequence from the > reference manual. So I'm hardly a reliable witness on what "typical" > users would expect. I think a "typical" user will want to be in that node as well, when she wants to read about "cut and paste".