From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] Builder, a build system integration for Emacs Date: Thu, 25 May 2023 16:09:03 +0300 Message-ID: <83a5xsmuc0.fsf@gnu.org> References: <95980ffc-86e7-ad54-4a20-539d8c6ea5d0@mailo.com> <3f68f4bc-d426-0bcc-1329-674c12b29386@mailo.com> <76e12f7c-335f-476b-ffb3-fd8e8e4ab5d0@mailo.com> <87pm6rx4ea.fsf@yahoo.com> <87wn0ytefw.fsf@gmail.com> <83h6s0n95y.fsf@gnu.org> <83edn4myz4.fsf@gnu.org> Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="31194"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: tomas@tuxteam.de, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Gregory Heytings Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu May 25 15:09:46 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1q2Aiv-0007uX-NY for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 25 May 2023 15:09:45 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1q2Ahr-0001Qu-GQ; Thu, 25 May 2023 09:08:39 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1q2Aho-0001PJ-It for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 25 May 2023 09:08:37 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1q2Ahn-0008C8-Gr; Thu, 25 May 2023 09:08:35 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From:Date: mime-version; bh=ucL662xkyns9yGagp3pxd2keDIpe2Qms8RAqhmYmGuw=; b=nvA7mKT3iBsL gv2gYLGpxzk7Rq+k5tBgjTqWGnVqaJwSm032qckfcNNWaPVi3/gXbp/oNlYkYO7l8ci+IObkDYuMj QcXFmocLo4R/ZhZ9t4ZxHdyyvbMozjvzjVQRrWndKRvDm4RLSQFUWD1/jOwYpMv/V3zLfOJ5cx551 xotzzPjrG+n+CcNUOC5ER0WlTMsssU4qe3jHs2K44rpuVWTYz5P30lPH/7rH0l2JXiLNeR9bzxYpB TUc6eghYWEXGhkFUXT4ilPiv55Pnpo4m+PsDY5aG/vEPEuwjA+0etkSZmf+jxW7UnEtECuNkMVMfS +PpvoJMmTOckqQw1tGgbmA==; Original-Received: from [87.69.77.57] (helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1q2Ahm-0004wu-Vs; Thu, 25 May 2023 09:08:35 -0400 In-Reply-To: (message from Gregory Heytings on Thu, 25 May 2023 11:53:29 +0000) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:306330 Archived-At: > Date: Thu, 25 May 2023 11:53:29 +0000 > From: Gregory Heytings > cc: tomas@tuxteam.de, emacs-devel@gnu.org > > > >>> I'm not aware of any "do-everything-for-me" build tool which will > >>> allow me to do all of the above. > >> > >> Now you are ;-) > > > > No, I am not. > > > > You asked specific questions, to which I provided specific answers. If > they were unclear, or if you have further questions, feel free to ask. The answers were clear, but they didn't present any solutions to the issues I brought up. None of the tools I'm aware of, including Cargo, support interactive selection of dependencies based on their features and requirements, nor provide any decision support for the kind of decisions I described. They allow you to specify a version, but leave the actual decision process to you. And if that is the case, why do I need them? I can easily build stuff myself once I've figured out which versions of what dependencies I need. And there's no need for you to work hard to try to represent the problems as having their solutions. Those build tools do not intend to solve those problems, they don't even consider them problems. They "know better". The facilities you described are nothing more than lip service.