From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Clojure mode Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2023 08:14:35 +0300 Message-ID: <837coytxs4.fsf@gnu.org> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="37900"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Ryan Tate Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun Sep 10 07:15:54 2023 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1qfCnZ-0009ec-7Z for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 10 Sep 2023 07:15:53 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1] helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qfCmb-0001KJ-An; Sun, 10 Sep 2023 01:14:53 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qfCmZ-0001HV-QR for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 10 Sep 2023 01:14:51 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1qfCmY-00009Q-Tb; Sun, 10 Sep 2023 01:14:50 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gnu.org; s=fencepost-gnu-org; h=MIME-version:References:Subject:In-Reply-To:To:From: Date; bh=IN0lpdVVe+L4s7moe2y//s3MSpQJR5zPCiOGPStZTfk=; b=HKFDQGQ7yKqR3exVWZiz vL0ljN0ax24DJoHNwaIzs/esER630ViT/8mD273yZEkO1k3LwMRb+PZ9wogpljeX2DtbFEp+A88pq wns1Ptv8GVY6P+5E+vBSTVFzb7lhECx/iJhAppe4ZUI3rvSuGRiGvEQA38i24q0o0bbzoydK5xi7i AAmeyPfTqepMvLnZwL9BxbZt/dSyo4Z9YyAFjBLlrB2L6Kx9Qucj/UDILvg5t+YQDrFGae9YMWhc+ pRZIGgefmNcYHmSqSUfLvSsP1ZaMsNrrGmOjgSKIxg13+bBbffK1qo7FaWormzUYhSXtKJ1iCaRma 3GnDW8RQj77SDw==; In-Reply-To: (message from Ryan Tate on Sat, 9 Sep 2023 15:39:53 -0400) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:310432 Archived-At: > From: Ryan Tate > Date: Sat, 9 Sep 2023 15:39:53 -0400 > > rms 26 Aug 2023: > > > If we install a command called clojure-mode in the core Emacs, that will in a sense be the preferred one. > > This is plainly a freedom 0 violation, intentionally thwarting a user’s wish to install a particular piece of software through the raw exercise of situational, incidental power never intentionally granted for this purpose. Bringing up ideas cannot possibly violate any freedoms, so please don't exaggerate. > As a longtime user of (and onetime patch contributor to) emacs, and as an active user of clojure mode and CIDER, I find it disappointing this is even being considered. Build a version of the mode under another license if you wish but get your own name rather than stealing one. You are in effect reviving an old thread that was a tempest in a teapot almost from the beginning, as soon as the developers of clojure-mode explicitly said they were not interested in donating their package to Emacs. (I think it was since then revealed that this decision was at least in part based on incorrect and/or outdated assumptions and impressions, but the decision still stands, although we certainly hope it will be reconsidered.) Moreover, you revive this old thread with harsh and unkind words, reprimanding us for bringing up ideas(!) whose only intent is to make Emacs better. Please in the future be kinder, and please remember that clojure-mode uses the power and flexibility of Emacs developed and brought to you by those same people whom you accuse here in crimes they didn't commit ("stealing the fruits of labor" etc.). Please in the future use kinder, more polite words when expressing opinions here, TIA.