bug#11612: 24.1; Defaults create warning on startup

bug#11612: 24.1; Defaults create warning on startup

[yary]

This bug report will be sent to the Bug-GNU-Emacs mailing list
and the GNU bug tracker at debbugs.gnu.org.  Please check that
the From: line contains a valid email address.  After a delay of up
to one day, you should receive an acknowledgement at that address.

Please write in English if possible, as the Emacs maintainers
usually do not have translators for other languages.

Please describe exactly what actions triggered the bug, and
the precise symptoms of the bug.  If you can, give a recipe
starting from `emacs -Q':


Using the Windows release candidate binaries, build 1 24.1,
running with emacs -Q, starts emacs with a *Warning* buffer:

Warning (initialization): Setting HOME to C:\ by default is deprecated

I believe previous emacs set HOME to %UserProfile% - regardless
of the setting for emacs 24, its default should not cause a warning,
or at least the warning could a suggest remedy.


If Emacs crashed, and you have the Emacs process in the gdb debugger,
please include the output from the following gdb commands:
    `bt full' and `xbacktrace'.
For information about debugging Emacs, please read the file
c:/Program Files/emacs-24/etc/DEBUG.


In GNU Emacs 24.1.1 (i386-mingw-nt5.1.2600)
 of 2012-06-01 on MARVIN
Windowing system distributor `Microsoft Corp.', version 5.1.2600
Configured using:
 `configure --with-gcc (4.6) --no-opt --enable-checking --cflags
 -ID:/devel/emacs/libs/libXpm-3.5.8/include
 -ID:/devel/emacs/libs/libXpm-3.5.8/src
 -ID:/devel/emacs/libs/libpng-dev_1.4.3-1/include
 -ID:/devel/emacs/libs/zlib-dev_1.2.5-2/include
 -ID:/devel/emacs/libs/giflib-4.1.4-1/include
 -ID:/devel/emacs/libs/jpeg-6b-4/include
 -ID:/devel/emacs/libs/tiff-3.8.2-1/include
 -ID:/devel/emacs/libs/gnutls-3.0.9/include'

Important settings:
  value of $LC_ALL: nil
  value of $LC_COLLATE: nil
  value of $LC_CTYPE: nil
  value of $LC_MESSAGES: nil
  value of $LC_MONETARY: nil
  value of $LC_NUMERIC: nil
  value of $LC_TIME: nil
  value of $LANG: ENU
  value of $XMODIFIERS: nil
  locale-coding-system: cp1252
  default enable-multibyte-characters: t

Major mode: Lisp Interaction

Minor modes in effect:
  tooltip-mode: t
  mouse-wheel-mode: t
  tool-bar-mode: t
  menu-bar-mode: t
  file-name-shadow-mode: t
  global-font-lock-mode: t
  font-lock-mode: t
  blink-cursor-mode: t
  auto-composition-mode: t
  auto-encryption-mode: t
  auto-compression-mode: t
  line-number-mode: t
  transient-mark-mode: t

Recent input:
<help-echo> <down-mouse-1> <mouse-movement> <mouse-movement>
<drag-mouse-1> M-w <help-echo> <down-mouse-1> <mouse-1>
M-x <help-echo> <help-echo> r e p o <tab> r <tab>
<return>

Recent messages:
For information about GNU Emacs and the GNU system, type C-h C-a.
Making completion list...

Load-path shadows:
None found.

Features:
(shadow sort gnus-util mail-extr emacsbug message format-spec rfc822 mml
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mm-util mail-prsvr mail-utils help-mode easymenu view warnings time-date
tooltip ediff-hook vc-hooks lisp-float-type mwheel dos-w32 disp-table
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hashtable-print-readable backquote make-network-process multi-tty emacs)

bug#11612: 24.1; Defaults create warning on startup

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: yary <not.com@gmail.com>
> Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2012 14:58:06 -0400
> 
> Using the Windows release candidate binaries, build 1 24.1,
> running with emacs -Q, starts emacs with a *Warning* buffer:
> 
> Warning (initialization): Setting HOME to C:\ by default is deprecated

This warning means that you have a .emacs file in C:\, which causes
Emacs to pretend that HOME is set to point to that directory.  This
arrangement is deprecated, and will cease to be supported in a future
version of Emacs.  Thus the warning.

IOW, this is a feature, not a bug.

I suggest to close this bug.

> I believe previous emacs set HOME to %UserProfile%

It will do that if you remove/rename C:\.emacs.

> - regardless of the setting for emacs 24, its default should not
> cause a warning, or at least the warning could a suggest remedy.

This is a feature.

bug#11612: 24.1; Defaults create warning on startup

[yary]

Oh, look at that, I do have a c:\.emacs file.

I did do a quick web search on this warning before sending the report,
and didn't get a description as good as the one you just emailed me.
Could the warning message "Setting HOME to C:\ by default is
deprecated" also include "Move .emacs out from C:\" or "See info ..."
to help us find the fix?

Thanks

-y


On Sat, Jun 2, 2012 at 3:18 PM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> wrote:
>> From: yary <not.com@gmail.com>
>> Date: Sat, 2 Jun 2012 14:58:06 -0400
>>
>> Using the Windows release candidate binaries, build 1 24.1,
>> running with emacs -Q, starts emacs with a *Warning* buffer:
>>
>> Warning (initialization): Setting HOME to C:\ by default is deprecated
>
> This warning means that you have a .emacs file in C:\, which causes
> Emacs to pretend that HOME is set to point to that directory.  This
> arrangement is deprecated, and will cease to be supported in a future
> version of Emacs.  Thus the warning.
>
> IOW, this is a feature, not a bug.
>
> I suggest to close this bug.
>
>> I believe previous emacs set HOME to %UserProfile%
>
> It will do that if you remove/rename C:\.emacs.
>
>> - regardless of the setting for emacs 24, its default should not
>> cause a warning, or at least the warning could a suggest remedy.
>
> This is a feature.

bug#11612: 24.1; Defaults create warning on startup

[Drew Adams]

> Could the warning message "Setting HOME to C:\ by default is
> deprecated" also include "Move .emacs out from C:\"

There is nothing wrong with having .emacs in c:\.

IIUC, this change is about Emacs not looking in c:\ _by default_.  It is not
about discouraging or forbidding anyone from setting HOME to c:\.

bug#11612: 24.1; Defaults create warning on startup

[yary]

On Sat, Jun 2, 2012 at 3:46 PM, Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com> wrote:
>> Could the warning message "Setting HOME to C:\ by default is
>> deprecated" also include "Move .emacs out from C:\"
>
> There is nothing wrong with having .emacs in c:\.
>
> IIUC, this change is about Emacs not looking in c:\ _by default_.  It is not
> about discouraging or forbidding anyone from setting HOME to c:\.

OK, I didn't know the background. A pointer to an info node about the
change might be more appropriate, give room for description.

The problem I had was being confronted with a warning, not being sure
of the source, not finding a variable "HOME" after typing "c-h v HOME"
("c-h v *home*" got me closer, but the docs for abbreviated-home-dir
didn't tell me much), and not knowing where and how HOME was being
set. So all this warning needs is a little more verbosity, giving the
end user more help on fixing the cause.

Thanks

bug#11612: 24.1; Defaults create warning on startup

[Michael]

yary <not.com <at> gmail.com> writes:

> 
> On Sat, Jun 2, 2012 at 3:46 PM, Drew Adams <drew.adams <at> oracle.com> 
wrote:
> >> Could the warning message "Setting HOME to C:\ by default is
> >> deprecated" also include "Move .emacs out from C:\"
> >
> > There is nothing wrong with having .emacs in c:\.
> >
> > IIUC, this change is about Emacs not looking in c:\ _by default_.  It is 
not
> > about discouraging or forbidding anyone from setting HOME to c:\.
> 
> OK, I didn't know the background. A pointer to an info node about the
> change might be more appropriate, give room for description.
> 
> The problem I had was being confronted with a warning, not being sure
> of the source, not finding a variable "HOME" after typing "c-h v HOME"
> ("c-h v *home*" got me closer, but the docs for abbreviated-home-dir
> didn't tell me much), and not knowing where and how HOME was being
> set. So all this warning needs is a little more verbosity, giving the
> end user more help on fixing the cause.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> 
This.  100 times this.  I have this warning coming up every time I open 
emacs.  It gives no indication of how to fix it.  Also, neither it, nor this 
thread, nor any number of other sites I found by searching give any 
indication of where the .emacs file is SUPPOSED to go instead.

bug#11612: 24.1; Defaults create warning on startup

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: Michael <mblischke@att.net>
> Date: Tue, 23 Apr 2013 14:05:11 +0000 (UTC)
> 
> This.  100 times this.  I have this warning coming up every time I open 
> emacs.  It gives no indication of how to fix it.  Also, neither it, nor this 
> thread, nor any number of other sites I found by searching give any 
> indication of where the .emacs file is SUPPOSED to go instead.

Rename c:\.emacs to something else.  Start Emacs and type:

  C-x C-f ~/.emacs RET

It will probably say "New file."  That's OK.  Now visit you previous
.emacs, now renamed to whatever you renamed it, and copy its entire
contents into the new ~/.emacs.  Type "C-x C-s".  Now Bob's your
uncle!  Restart Emacs, and you can safely forget about this.

bug#11612: 24.1; Defaults create warning on startup

[Juanma Barranquero]

On Sat, Jun 2, 2012 at 9:46 PM, Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com> wrote:

> IIUC, this change is about Emacs not looking in c:\ _by default_.  It is not
> about discouraging or forbidding anyone from setting HOME to c:\.

Correct.

    Juanma

bug#11612: 24.1; Defaults create warning on startup

[Jason Rumney]

"Drew Adams" <drew.adams@oracle.com> writes:

>> Could the warning message "Setting HOME to C:\ by default is
>> deprecated" also include "Move .emacs out from C:\"
>
> There is nothing wrong with having .emacs in c:\.
>
> IIUC, this change is about Emacs not looking in c:\ _by default_.  It is not
> about discouraging or forbidding anyone from setting HOME to c:\.

Given that in Windows 7 writing to c:\ requires administrative
priviledges, perhaps we should be more strongly discouraging setting
HOME to c:\ for users who are blindly copying obsolete instructions they
find on the internet.

bug#11612: 24.1; Defaults create warning on startup

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: Jason Rumney <jasonr@gnu.org>
> Cc: "'yary'" <not.com@gmail.com>,  "'Eli Zaretskii'" <eliz@gnu.org>,  11612@debbugs.gnu.org
> Date: Mon, 04 Jun 2012 11:50:49 +0800
> 
> Given that in Windows 7 writing to c:\ requires administrative
> priviledges, perhaps we should be more strongly discouraging setting
> HOME to c:\ for users who are blindly copying obsolete instructions they
> find on the internet.

Maybe.  But the current situation was the necessary first step anyway,
because someone who sets HOME to C:\ at least did something deliberate
she might remember.

OTOH, I kinda gather that lots of people disable UAC on Windows 7, so
perhaps the issue is no more pressing now than it was with XP.

bug#11612: 24.1; Defaults create warning on startup

[Drew Adams]

> Given that in Windows 7 writing to c:\ requires administrative
> priviledges, perhaps we should be more strongly discouraging setting
> HOME to c:\ for users who are blindly copying obsolete 
> instructions they find on the internet.

Why?  What is the consequence if an Emacs user (using admin privileges) sets
HOME to c:\?  Not a rhetorical question - I know little to nothing about this.

_If_ (dunno) there is no negative consequence in terms of _using_ Emacs, and the
only effective consequence is that Windows 7 will notify a user that s?he must
have admin privileges to _set_ HOME to c:\, is that a problem?

In any case, if there is a downside then the "discouragement" or recommendation
should explicitly point out the situation - e.g. list potential problems or
point (via URL) to such a list of problems.  We should not just discourage c:\
for all Windows users, or even for Windows 7 users only, without giving some
info about why etc.

bug#11612: 24.1; Defaults create warning on startup

[Noam Postavsky]

So it's just a matter of changing the warning message to something a
little more informative, right? What's the best way of referencing the
a manual node in a warning message? In Lisp I could make a hyperlink
like this:

(display-warning 'initialization
                 (concat "Use of `C:\\.emacs' to define `HOME' is
deprecated, see "
                         (make-text-button "HOME and Startup
Directories on MS-Windows" nil
                                           :type 'help-info
                                           'help-args '("(emacs)
Windows HOME"))))

it's a bit more awkward from C, and I'm not sure if make-text-button
can be called that early in the initialization process.

bug#11612: 24.1; Defaults create warning on startup

[Drew Adams]

> What's the best way of referencing the a manual node in a warning message?

I don't know what an official answer might be, but I'd say that
a fairly standard way to talk about a node is to use the manual
name in parens followed by the node name in `...'.  For example:

  (elisp) `Customization Types'

It used to be that we used no space after `)', but now I think
a space is common.

bug#11612: 24.1; Defaults create warning on startup

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: Noam Postavsky <npostavs@users.sourceforge.net>
> Date: Fri, 24 Jun 2016 23:28:55 -0400
> Cc: yary <not.com@gmail.com>, Juanma Barranquero <lekktu@gmail.com>,
> 	Michael <mblischke@att.net>, Jason Rumney <jasonr@gnu.org>
> 
> So it's just a matter of changing the warning message to something a
> little more informative, right? What's the best way of referencing the
> a manual node in a warning message? In Lisp I could make a hyperlink
> like this:
> 
> (display-warning 'initialization
>                  (concat "Use of `C:\\.emacs' to define `HOME' is
> deprecated, see "
>                          (make-text-button "HOME and Startup
> Directories on MS-Windows" nil
>                                            :type 'help-info
>                                            'help-args '("(emacs)
> Windows HOME"))))
> 
> it's a bit more awkward from C, and I'm not sure if make-text-button
> can be called that early in the initialization process.

It wouldn't have helped anyway.  However, nowadays this warning is
added to delayed-warnings-list, whose display is handled in Lisp.

FWIW, repeating the OP's recipe, Emacs now starts with a split-window
configuration, with the selected window showing the *scratch* buffer,
and the *Warnings* buffer displaying the above-mentioned warning.  So
I'm not sure the original complaint is still valid.

bug#11612: 24.1; Defaults create warning on startup

[Noam Postavsky]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 778 bytes --]

On Sat, Jun 25, 2016 at 4:16 AM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> wrote:
>
> FWIW, repeating the OP's recipe, Emacs now starts with a split-window
> configuration, with the selected window showing the *scratch* buffer,
> and the *Warnings* buffer displaying the above-mentioned warning.  So
> I'm not sure the original complaint is still valid.

I think the complaint is more about the wording of the message and
less about the buffer/window configuration. So I propose rewording it
to

    Use of `C:\.emacs' to define `HOME' is deprecated, see (emacs)
`Windows Home'

This way the user will be pointed to the relevant section of the
manual, and since the warning uses the same phrasing as the manual,
searching for the warning should turn up links to that manual section
as well.

[-- Attachment #2: 0001-Give-more-helpful-warning-about-setting-HOME.patch --]
[-- Type: text/x-patch, Size: 1252 bytes --]

From 7f005e4fbde188125204aae5ca0620dc953179ad Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001
From: Noam Postavsky <npostavs@gmail.com>
Date: Sat, 25 Jun 2016 09:26:12 -0400
Subject: [PATCH] Give more helpful warning about setting HOME

* src/w32.c (init_environment): Improve warning message that pops when
Emacs sets HOME according to existence of C:\.emacs (Bug #11612).
---
 src/w32.c | 9 ++++++---
 1 file changed, 6 insertions(+), 3 deletions(-)

diff --git a/src/w32.c b/src/w32.c
index c26f145..f37cb62 100644
--- a/src/w32.c
+++ b/src/w32.c
@@ -2773,9 +2773,12 @@ init_environment (char ** argv)
 		  }
 		if (strcmp (env_vars[i].name, "HOME") == 0 && !appdata)
 		  Vdelayed_warnings_list
-		    = Fcons (listn (CONSTYPE_HEAP, 2,
-				    intern ("initialization"),
-				    build_string ("Setting HOME to C:\\ by default is deprecated")),
+                    = Fcons (listn
+                             (CONSTYPE_HEAP, 2,
+                              intern ("initialization"),
+                              build_string ("Use of `C:\\.emacs' to "
+                                            "define `HOME' is deprecated,"
+                                            "see (emacs) `Windows Home'.")),
 			     Vdelayed_warnings_list);
 	      }
 
-- 
2.8.0

bug#11612: 24.1; Defaults create warning on startup

[yary]

On Sat, Jun 25, 2016 at 9:42 AM, Noam Postavsky
<npostavs@users.sourceforge.net> wrote:
> I think the complaint is more about the wording of the message and
> less about the buffer/window configuration. So I propose rewording it
> to
>
>     Use of `C:\.emacs' to define `HOME' is deprecated, see (emacs)
> `Windows Home'
>
> This way the user will be pointed to the relevant section of the
> manual, and since the warning uses the same phrasing as the manual,
> searching for the warning should turn up links to that manual section
> as well.


Yes, thanks, that message is clear and would have prevented my
original bug report!

bug#11612: 24.1; Defaults create warning on startup

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: Noam Postavsky <npostavs@users.sourceforge.net>
> Date: Sat, 25 Jun 2016 09:42:31 -0400
> Cc: 11612@debbugs.gnu.org, yary <not.com@gmail.com>, 
> 	Juanma Barranquero <lekktu@gmail.com>, Michael <mblischke@att.net>, Jason Rumney <jasonr@gnu.org>
> 
> > FWIW, repeating the OP's recipe, Emacs now starts with a split-window
> > configuration, with the selected window showing the *scratch* buffer,
> > and the *Warnings* buffer displaying the above-mentioned warning.  So
> > I'm not sure the original complaint is still valid.
> 
> I think the complaint is more about the wording of the message and
> less about the buffer/window configuration. So I propose rewording it
> to
> 
>     Use of `C:\.emacs' to define `HOME' is deprecated, see (emacs)
> `Windows Home'

I don't think this is significantly more clear than the current text.
"Use of `C:\.emacs' to define `HOME'" is only understandable by people
who know how Emacs on Windows defines HOME when it is not defined in
the environment.  If we want to come up with a better text, let's make
it very clear.

How about this text instead:

  Use of `C:\.emacs' without defining `HOME' in the environment is deprecated, see `Windows Home' in the Emacs manual.

bug#11612: 24.1; Defaults create warning on startup

[Noam Postavsky]

On Sat, Jun 25, 2016 at 10:18 AM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> wrote:
>>     Use of `C:\.emacs' to define `HOME' is deprecated, see (emacs)
>> `Windows Home'
>
> I don't think this is significantly more clear than the current text.
> "Use of `C:\.emacs' to define `HOME'" is only understandable by people
> who know how Emacs on Windows defines HOME when it is not defined in
> the environment.  If we want to come up with a better text, let's make
> it very clear.
>
> How about this text instead:
>
>   Use of `C:\.emacs' without defining `HOME' in the environment is deprecated, see `Windows Home' in the Emacs manual.

Looks good; I was trying to keep it short, but probably I went too short.

bug#11612: 24.1; Defaults create warning on startup

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: Noam Postavsky <npostavs@users.sourceforge.net>
> Date: Sat, 25 Jun 2016 11:30:58 -0400
> Cc: 11612@debbugs.gnu.org, yary hluchan <not.com@gmail.com>, 
> 	Juanma Barranquero <lekktu@gmail.com>, Michael <mblischke@att.net>, Jason Rumney <jasonr@gnu.org>
> 
> >   Use of `C:\.emacs' without defining `HOME' in the environment is deprecated, see `Windows Home' in the Emacs manual.
> 
> Looks good; I was trying to keep it short, but probably I went too short.

It's `Windows HOME', btw.

Thanks.

bug#11612: 24.1; Defaults create warning on startup

[Noam Postavsky]

Version: 25.1

On Sat, Jun 25, 2016 at 11:40 AM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> wrote:
>> >   Use of `C:\.emacs' without defining `HOME' in the environment is deprecated, see `Windows Home' in the Emacs manual.
> It's `Windows HOME', btw.

Pushed as fd9fad06

bug#11612: 24.1; Defaults create warning on startup

[Andy Moreton]

On Sun 26 Jun 2016, Noam Postavsky wrote:

> Version: 25.1
>
> On Sat, Jun 25, 2016 at 11:40 AM, Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org> wrote:
>>> >   Use of `C:\.emacs' without defining `HOME' in the environment is deprecated, see `Windows Home' in the Emacs manual.
>> It's `Windows HOME', btw.
>
> Pushed as fd9fad06

Please test patches before pushing - that commit does not build.
The following patch fixes it:

diff --git a/src/w32.c b/src/w32.c
index 6948fde..9a8c248 100644
--- a/src/w32.c
+++ b/src/w32.c
@@ -2778,7 +2778,7 @@ init_environment (char ** argv)
                             intern ("initialization"), build_string
                             ("Use of `C:\\.emacs' without defining `HOME' "
                              "in the environment is deprecated,\n"
-                             "see `Windows Home' in the Emacs manual."))),
+                             "see `Windows Home' in the Emacs manual.")),
                     Vdelayed_warnings_list);
              }

bug#11612: 24.1; Defaults create warning on startup

[Noam Postavsky]

On Mon, Jun 27, 2016 at 7:15 AM, Andy Moreton <andrewjmoreton@gmail.com> wrote:
> Please test patches before pushing - that commit does not build.

Ack, sorry! I was thinking it since it was just changing a warning
message it would suffice to see it compile, but I stupidly checked
that on my GNU/Linux box; obviously w32.c doesn't get compiled at all
there!