From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>
To: Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com>
Cc: 17362@debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: bug#17362: 24.4.50; inconsistent key notation: `ESC' vs `<ESC>'
Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2014 20:51:57 +0300 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <8361lsm3b6.fsf@gnu.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <f2425601-bc55-4f33-ba22-5a2045fdf78a@default>
> Date: Tue, 29 Apr 2014 10:27:03 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com>
> Cc: dmoncayo@gmail.com, 17362-done@debbugs.gnu.org
>
> > > Eli, are you saying that you have replaced <delete>, <backspace>, etc.
> > > everywhere with <DELETE>, <BACKSPACE>, etc., or that you think it is
> > > appropriate to do so?
> >
> > Only for BACKSPACE (and, of course, only in the manual). It's still
> > "Delete" (because that's the label on the key). ESC and TAB and SPC
> > and RET were always in caps, so they stay in caps.
>
> <Delete> is not how Emacs refers to the key in help. And neither is
> <BACKSPACE>. Emacs help calls these <delete> and <backspace>, AFAICT.
I'm not talking about help, I'm only talking about the manual. The
bug report was about inconsistencies in the manual. At least that's
how I perceived it, and that's the only issue I set out to fix.
> > > Seems like that would be a big change from the past and a change from
> > > how Emacs itself communicates with users. AFAIK, Emacs writes <delete>
> > > for the Delete key etc. The rule for function keys and pseudo function
> > > keys has always been to use lowercase (in angle brackets), no?
> >
> > Yes, because they are symbols. I did nothing about symbols, of
> > course.
>
> What does that mean?
Which part is unclear?
> Emacs writes <backspace>. Why write <BACKSPACE>? Emacs writes
> <delete>. Why write Delete or <Delete>?
See the guidelines I used to decide on names and capitalization, I
tried to explain why I choose this or that convention.
> My point is that the manual should write key sequences the same way
> Emacs writes them interactively, e.g., in help output. It does not
> refer to a <BACKSPACE> key or a Backspace key or a <CNTL>, <Control>,
> Control, or Ctrl key. Emacs help writes <backspace> and C- in key
> sequences.
If that's the issue, then (a) it was nowhere clear from your original
bug report, and (b) I will have nothing to do with it, sorry. I don't
care enough about it to work on that.
I only fixed inconsistencies in the manual, without any relation to
what Emacs says in help mode.
> Do you even agree that key sequences should be written the same way
> in the manual as in the rest of Emacs? Do agree that the manual,
> like the rest of Emacs, should write <C-left> and not C-<left>,
> <C-home> and not C-<Home>?
Perhaps it could be nice (although it never bothered me), but I think
it's close to impossible now, due to various historical reasons. In
any case, I'm not going to do anything about this, someone else will
have to step forward. I found your complaint about inconsistencies in
the manual justified, and I fixed that; my job here is now done.
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2014-04-29 17:51 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 22+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
[not found] <<47b1a857-a5d6-4e5a-b8f6-f96f9e201c89@default>
[not found] ` <<CAH8Pv0i8RqY8JpPEurRycUwRp_C1_UZ5NN5MXwW3uQ74kYeQDQ@mail.gmail.com>
[not found] ` <<83fvkxo4kc.fsf@gnu.org>
2014-04-28 15:39 ` bug#17362: 24.4.50; inconsistent key notation: `ESC' vs `<ESC>' Drew Adams
2014-04-28 16:15 ` Eli Zaretskii
[not found] ` <<b73bc016-5fd5-4af5-879c-18c14a989a14@default>
[not found] ` <<83fvkwmagn.fsf@gnu.org>
2014-04-29 15:40 ` Drew Adams
2014-04-29 16:19 ` Eli Zaretskii
[not found] ` <<4294927c-08b3-4c65-83e4-1582e8d0d859@default>
[not found] ` <<838uqom7lm.fsf@gnu.org>
2014-04-29 17:27 ` Drew Adams
2014-04-29 17:51 ` Eli Zaretskii [this message]
2014-04-29 21:55 ` Josh
2014-04-29 23:00 ` Drew Adams
2014-04-30 2:55 ` Eli Zaretskii
[not found] ` <<f2425601-bc55-4f33-ba22-5a2045fdf78a@default>
[not found] ` <<8361lsm3b6.fsf@gnu.org>
2014-04-29 18:12 ` Drew Adams
2014-04-29 18:34 ` Eli Zaretskii
[not found] <<d035db75-bf2f-4a7e-bca3-684f76f17742@default>
[not found] ` <<8338gwlz7v.fsf@gnu.org>
2014-04-29 19:38 ` Drew Adams
2014-04-30 2:51 ` Eli Zaretskii
[not found] <<c30f764a-5327-47f4-8bf6-ef6ad993518d@default>
[not found] ` <<834n1cm1bx.fsf@gnu.org>
2014-04-29 19:09 ` Drew Adams
2014-04-29 19:20 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-04-29 19:24 ` Eli Zaretskii
[not found] <<e9c40932-a5e6-4e19-ac69-5b656438a555@default>
[not found] ` <<83bnvlo2fh.fsf@gnu.org>
2014-04-28 16:20 ` Drew Adams
2014-04-28 14:29 Drew Adams
2014-04-28 14:49 ` Dani Moncayo
2014-04-28 15:25 ` Drew Adams
2014-04-29 15:17 ` Eli Zaretskii
2014-04-28 15:29 ` Eli Zaretskii
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