From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: master d014a5e: Use fixed-pitch font for display-line-numbers Date: Fri, 14 Jul 2017 09:56:35 +0300 Message-ID: <834lufh5gc.fsf@gnu.org> References: <20170711151708.4322.33014@vcs0.savannah.gnu.org> <20170711151709.2AE9822E0A@vcs0.savannah.gnu.org> <8760eyv7mc.fsf@holos> <83h8yhiuy3.fsf@gnu.org> <83wp7cgwie.fsf@gnu.org> <83k23cgny7.fsf@gnu.org> <87shi08562.fsf@lylat> Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1500015433 25388 195.159.176.226 (14 Jul 2017 06:57:13 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 14 Jul 2017 06:57:13 +0000 (UTC) Cc: mvoteiza@udel.edu, emacs-devel@gnu.org, yuri.v.khan@gmail.com To: Alex Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Jul 14 08:57:09 2017 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1dVuXF-0006PC-C7 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 14 Jul 2017 08:57:09 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:35855 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dVuXK-0000ZP-QU for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 14 Jul 2017 02:57:14 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:52643) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dVuWo-0000YD-Lw for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 14 Jul 2017 02:56:43 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dVuWk-0004hE-Pt for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 14 Jul 2017 02:56:42 -0400 Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::e]:53033) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dVuWk-0004hA-Mn; Fri, 14 Jul 2017 02:56:38 -0400 Original-Received: from 84.94.185.246.cable.012.net.il ([84.94.185.246]:3997 helo=home-c4e4a596f7) by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256) (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from ) id 1dVuWi-00077m-Vz; Fri, 14 Jul 2017 02:56:38 -0400 In-reply-to: <87shi08562.fsf@lylat> (message from Alex on Thu, 13 Jul 2017 14:15:17 -0600) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 2001:4830:134:3::e X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:216636 Archived-At: > From: Alex > Cc: Yuri Khan , mvoteiza@udel.edu, emacs-devel@gnu.org > Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2017 14:15:17 -0600 > > > The name alone might suggest that, but the code tells a different > > story. I thought you looked in the code and saw there something I > > missed, thus my questions. > > Where does the code tell a different story? If you mean > `face-font-family-alternatives', then I believe it is faulty (see > below). Faulty or not, it tells its story better than the name does. > In Emacs 25.2 on Windows 7, the default face is Courier New, a serif > font. GNU/Linux defaults to DejaVu Sans Mono, a sans-serif font. I don't > see why Windows should default to a serif font. FWIW, I checked a couple > of other popular text editors (Sublime and Atom), and they default to > Consolas (sans-serif) on Windows. > > The bigger issue here is that fixed-pitch-serif on Windows defaults to a > sans-serif font (Consolas), and that fixed-pitch defaults to a serif > font (Courier -- not Courier New like the default font). Being serif or sans-serif is not the most important attribute of a font that Emacs can use as its default. A much more important attribute is how many Unicode blocks and characters within those blocks a font supports. On my Windows XP, Courier New supports twice as many blocks and characters as Consolas; on Windows 8.1 Consolas is much better, but still lags in coverage behind Courier New. So using Consolas just because other applications do that is not necessarily TRT for Emacs; we must consider other factors of importance to us. > I believe the following should happen: > > * the defaults for the default face and fixed-pitch should align on > all systems possible > > * fixed-pitch should default to what fixed-pitch serif does now > (Consolas seems suitable) > > * fixed-pitch-serif should default to what the default face does > currently > > If this is done, then changing the line-number face to plain "Monospace" > should work fine even for Windows. Sorry, I disagree with making these changes, certainly not for the benefit of a minor feature such as display-line-numbers. We have been using Courier New by default since about forever; changing that now is bound to send ripples all over the place, since many other face- and font-related settings are based on that. I have now reverted the change which prompted this sub-thread; I hope that will make everyone (except James, perhaps ;-) happier, and we can put this issue to rest.