From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Why not zlib-compress-region? Date: Sat, 28 Jun 2014 20:00:34 +0300 Message-ID: <831tu96kb1.fsf@gnu.org> References: <53AC0D17.9020604@yandex.ru> <53AD8EA8.9090805@yandex.ru> <83egy97cj6.fsf@gnu.org> <87k381w61p.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <83a98x6up5.fsf@gnu.org> <87fvipvvwk.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1403974871 21947 80.91.229.3 (28 Jun 2014 17:01:11 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 28 Jun 2014 17:01:11 +0000 (UTC) Cc: aurelien.aptel+emacs@gmail.com, dmantipov@yandex.ru, emacs-devel@gnu.org, sdl.web@gmail.com, monnier@iro.umontreal.ca To: "Stephen J. Turnbull" Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Jun 28 19:01:05 2014 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1X0vzr-0004ee-Oz for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 28 Jun 2014 19:01:03 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:55352 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1X0vzr-000811-6Q for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 28 Jun 2014 13:01:03 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:48800) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1X0vzh-0007pR-B6 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 28 Jun 2014 13:00:57 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1X0vza-0002BB-7a for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 28 Jun 2014 13:00:53 -0400 Original-Received: from mtaout27.012.net.il ([80.179.55.183]:55730) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1X0vzZ-0002Au-Qh for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 28 Jun 2014 13:00:46 -0400 Original-Received: from conversion-daemon.mtaout27.012.net.il by mtaout27.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) id <0N7W00B001EGYO00@mtaout27.012.net.il> for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 28 Jun 2014 19:57:17 +0300 (IDT) Original-Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([87.69.4.28]) by mtaout27.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) with ESMTPA id <0N7W004O91RHUX80@mtaout27.012.net.il>; Sat, 28 Jun 2014 19:57:17 +0300 (IDT) In-reply-to: <87fvipvvwk.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> X-012-Sender: halo1@inter.net.il X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6.x X-Received-From: 80.179.55.183 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:172802 Archived-At: > From: "Stephen J. Turnbull" > Cc: aurelien.aptel+emacs@gmail.com, > sdl.web@gmail.com, > dmantipov@yandex.ru, > monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, > emacs-devel@gnu.org > Date: Sun, 29 Jun 2014 01:30:51 +0900 > > Eli Zaretskii writes: > > > I know about the package managers, I just wanted to make a point that > > AFAIU end-user Posix systems might well lack a compiler. AFAIR, on > > non-free Posix systems, installing a compiler actually costs money. > > Not on Mac OS X. And how many important non-free POSIX systems aren't > supported by GCC (not to mention The-Compiler-Suite-That-Shall-Not-Be- > Mentioned-On-GNU-Channels)? Again, building GCC is not something an end user would easily consider when all she needs is to be able to use some plugin. > The real problem for those is more likely whether there is an > enterprise requirement for vetting all installed software. Yes, that too. > FFI implementations that *don't* require compilers have their > problems, too, since Lisp types sometimes map to different C types for > different libraries, which requires a lot of fiddly low-level > knowledge on the part of the Lisp programmers that (if they stick to > pure Lisp) they just don't need at all. FFI == crashable Lisp. Something to consider, I'm sure. But that doesn't make the problem of having to have a working compiler installation in any way. > > > usually without going through DLL hell > > > > (This is unrelated.) I don't believe in package managers as a > > means to avoid the "DLL hell". Dependencies are written by people, > > which are prone to errors, and having several libFOO.so versions on > > the same system, even if their names don't conflict, is not fun. > > I have a bunch of them (three versions of GTK, two of libpng for > example). I don't notice it at all I have more than "a bunch" of them, too. This is not about you or me, you know. > > We are talking about the compiler and Binutils. Building those, > > especially the former, is not for the faint at heart, not even on a > > Posix host. > > Nonsense. I do it about once a month, sometimes twice a week > (automatically via Gentoo's Portage PMS, which always builds from > source). Again, this is not about you or me.