From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Eli Zaretskii Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#20135: 25.0.50; Emacs manual typos for key bindings Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2015 21:12:46 +0200 Message-ID: <831tkmxgpd.fsf@gnu.org> References: <83619yxl9i.fsf@gnu.org> <237c103a-4391-4792-adf3-e35b6d7fceff@default> Reply-To: Eli Zaretskii NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1426706296 29847 80.91.229.3 (18 Mar 2015 19:18:16 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2015 19:18:16 +0000 (UTC) Cc: 20135@debbugs.gnu.org To: Drew Adams Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Mar 18 20:18:08 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1YYJTi-0004UM-Rq for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Wed, 18 Mar 2015 20:18:07 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:35382 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1YYJTi-000468-9Z for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Wed, 18 Mar 2015 15:18:06 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:53200) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1YYJOt-0004EC-6i for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 18 Mar 2015 15:13:08 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1YYJOp-00067B-3L for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 18 Mar 2015 15:13:07 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.43]:53365) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1YYJOp-000675-0f for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 18 Mar 2015 15:13:03 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1YYJOo-0001sg-DX for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 18 Mar 2015 15:13:02 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2015 19:13:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 20135 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 20135-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B20135.14267059807222 (code B ref 20135); Wed, 18 Mar 2015 19:13:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 20135) by debbugs.gnu.org; 18 Mar 2015 19:13:00 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51933 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1YYJOl-0001sQ-Dv for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 18 Mar 2015 15:12:59 -0400 Original-Received: from mtaout25.012.net.il ([80.179.55.181]:47120) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1YYJOi-0001sD-Py for 20135@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 18 Mar 2015 15:12:58 -0400 Original-Received: from conversion-daemon.mtaout25.012.net.il by mtaout25.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) id <0NLF005008UAFH00@mtaout25.012.net.il> for 20135@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 18 Mar 2015 21:07:50 +0200 (IST) Original-Received: from HOME-C4E4A596F7 ([87.69.4.28]) by mtaout25.012.net.il (HyperSendmail v2007.08) with ESMTPA id <0NLF004F79517620@mtaout25.012.net.il>; Wed, 18 Mar 2015 21:07:50 +0200 (IST) In-reply-to: <237c103a-4391-4792-adf3-e35b6d7fceff@default> X-012-Sender: halo1@inter.net.il X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x X-Received-From: 140.186.70.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:100630 Archived-At: > Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2015 11:34:14 -0700 (PDT) > From: Drew Adams > Cc: 20135@debbugs.gnu.org > > > > Do we write `' or `S-'? Or do we use both conventions, and if > > > so, are they interchangeable (same meaning)? > > > > S- is the right way for the manuals. > > Any chance to revisit that? Not for the manuals: this is how makeinfo translates @kbd{S-@key{up}}, which is how one should write modified keys in Texinfo. > > > Another question is about whether, aside from special cases (which are > > > already called out, AFAIK), function-key names should be written using > > > uppercase. For example, is `" correct, or should it be > > > `" (or `S-')? > > > > We've been though this before, and AFAIK the manual was fixed to be > > consistent at that time. > > I know nothing about whether that was the case. But it does not seem to > be consistent now, at least. As I said, feel free to point out specific inconsistencies, keeping in mind that upper-case is the rule. > > In the doc strings, that's substitution, right? It's not that these > > are written verbatim in the doc string, right? If so, they are > > formatted how the relevant APIs (key-description, I believe) do it. > > Correct. It is generally `key-description' that provides help commands > with their syntax. > > Which means that this is the syntax users will be likely to see most > often. Which means that it might well be the syntax that they will > try (mistakenly) to use when searching the manual, for instance. Let's not reiterate old arguments. > But why would you give as a reason being consistent with TAB, SPC, DEL, > etc., which are *exceptions* (correponding to ASCII names)? > > Why not speak about consistency with the other function keys and > pseudofunction keys - , , , etc.? Where a key has a name printed on it, we should try using that name literally, except when there's some tradition to the contrary. > > If we want the doc strings to follow suit, the relevant primitives should > > be changed to follow suit. > > I don't want to change the doc strings to follow suit. I think the manual > should reflect Emacs itself: its doc strings, help output, `key-description'. Then you should be posting this bug report to the Texinfo list, because they will have to change the Info output. > You can search as well as I. Sorry, not enough time.