From mboxrd@z Thu Jan  1 00:00:00 1970
Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail
From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>
Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs
Subject: bug#41821: 28.0.50;
 read-directory-name in vc commands should provide defaults from
 projects
Date: Thu, 02 Jul 2020 16:36:54 +0300
Message-ID: <831rluxcll.fsf@gnu.org>
References: <87r1ulxk48.fsf@mail.linkov.net>
 <dbb82a30-fdbc-f9af-49c0-b7b857933637@yandex.ru>
 <87y2oh8fdv.fsf@mail.linkov.net>
 <ed4d76c6-3ef2-cf0b-5f8b-3b3bd61bdee5@yandex.ru>
 <87366ohw5z.fsf@mail.linkov.net>
 <c9db50b6-fa5a-aa0b-076b-0fbcbcdec7b4@yandex.ru>
 <878sge7jls.fsf@mail.linkov.net>
 <7e136435-7123-fa42-e4a8-66b82e6595da@yandex.ru>
 <87pn9pxris.fsf@mail.linkov.net> <83d05ottnw.fsf@gnu.org>
 <0b42f540-f779-446b-4411-8dae3a50d09d@yandex.ru> <837dvwtrv1.fsf@gnu.org>
 <835zbgtqps.fsf@gnu.org> <625de669-0715-1467-0bd1-84328b4bee5f@yandex.ru>
 <83wo3ws4g8.fsf@gnu.org> <f9cd868b-ca2f-bb8e-9b48-af37cc215855@yandex.ru>
 <83tuyzs2np.fsf@gnu.org> <87h7uuj1v3.fsf@mail.linkov.net>
 <d93d0f5a-7067-de6a-c2f5-c263864c479e@yandex.ru>
 <87h7utjx75.fsf@mail.linkov.net>
 <3f9e85ba-66a9-abd0-61bf-800ea8bb4ee3@yandex.ru>
 <87eepw5nlt.fsf@mail.linkov.net>
 <faccdab8-153d-b31c-4be6-81bb924a200b@yandex.ru> <83v9j7xpoj.fsf@gnu.org>
 <990a9046-c4e6-efb2-01dd-60198994127b@yandex.ru>
Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214";
	logging-data="5665"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io"
Cc: 41821@debbugs.gnu.org, juri@linkov.net
To: Dmitry Gutov <dgutov@yandex.ru>
Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu Jul 02 15:43:11 2020
Return-path: <bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org>
Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org
Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17])
	by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
	(Exim 4.92)
	(envelope-from <bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org>)
	id 1jqzUc-0001Ng-Tg
	for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 02 Jul 2020 15:43:10 +0200
Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:45930 helo=lists1p.gnu.org)
	by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1)
	(envelope-from <bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org>)
	id 1jqzUb-00033F-Uk
	for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 02 Jul 2020 09:43:09 -0400
Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:38704)
 by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256)
 (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <Debian-debbugs@debbugs.gnu.org>)
 id 1jqzPe-0002zR-Or
 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 02 Jul 2020 09:38:02 -0400
Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.43]:43049)
 by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128)
 (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from <Debian-debbugs@debbugs.gnu.org>)
 id 1jqzPe-0004TQ-Da
 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 02 Jul 2020 09:38:02 -0400
Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.84_2)
 (envelope-from <Debian-debbugs@debbugs.gnu.org>) id 1jqzPe-0007R3-BL
 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 02 Jul 2020 09:38:02 -0400
X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org
Resent-From: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>
Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" <debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org>
Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org
Resent-Date: Thu, 02 Jul 2020 13:38:02 +0000
Resent-Message-ID: <handler.41821.B41821.159369702828518@debbugs.gnu.org>
Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org
X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 41821
X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs
X-GNU-PR-Keywords: fixed
Original-Received: via spool by 41821-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B41821.159369702828518
 (code B ref 41821); Thu, 02 Jul 2020 13:38:02 +0000
Original-Received: (at 41821) by debbugs.gnu.org; 2 Jul 2020 13:37:08 +0000
Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:54595 helo=debbugs.gnu.org)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
 (envelope-from <debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org>)
 id 1jqzOm-0007Pu-8i
 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 02 Jul 2020 09:37:08 -0400
Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([209.51.188.92]:52208)
 by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2)
 (envelope-from <eliz@gnu.org>) id 1jqzOi-0007PO-H3
 for 41821@debbugs.gnu.org; Thu, 02 Jul 2020 09:37:07 -0400
Original-Received: from fencepost.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::e]:60876)
 by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1)
 (envelope-from <eliz@gnu.org>)
 id 1jqzOc-0004H3-9n; Thu, 02 Jul 2020 09:36:58 -0400
Original-Received: from [176.228.60.248] (port=4959 helo=home-c4e4a596f7)
 by fencepost.gnu.org with esmtpsa (TLS1.2:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:256)
 (Exim 4.82) (envelope-from <eliz@gnu.org>)
 id 1jqzOb-0007uS-MS; Thu, 02 Jul 2020 09:36:58 -0400
In-Reply-To: <990a9046-c4e6-efb2-01dd-60198994127b@yandex.ru> (message from
 Dmitry Gutov on Wed, 1 Jul 2020 23:24:19 +0300)
X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.18
Precedence: list
X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org
List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs,
 the Swiss army knife of text editors" <bug-gnu-emacs.gnu.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/options/bug-gnu-emacs>,
 <mailto:bug-gnu-emacs-request@gnu.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/bug-gnu-emacs>
List-Post: <mailto:bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org>
List-Help: <mailto:bug-gnu-emacs-request@gnu.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/bug-gnu-emacs>,
 <mailto:bug-gnu-emacs-request@gnu.org?subject=subscribe>
Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org
Original-Sender: "bug-gnu-emacs"
 <bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org>
Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.bugs:182633
Archived-At: <http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.bugs/182633>

> Cc: 41821@debbugs.gnu.org, juri@linkov.net
> From: Dmitry Gutov <dgutov@yandex.ru>
> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2020 23:24:19 +0300
> 
> On 01.07.2020 17:42, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
> > Like you, Dmitry, I'm a bit uneasy with mixing the two sets of
> > features.  We should decide on some concept and try to stick to it;
> > right now, it seems to me that we prefer to have specialized commands
> > in project.el rather than inject project.el-specific nits into
> > commands outside project.el, which I think could be a slippery slope.
> 
> In my previous message I drew a line, of sorts, where I think it's okay 
> to suggest directories to search in in rgrep from known project roots. I 
> do think it's okay.
> 
> I'm not sure if I understand your position, because you say you agree, 
> but then make a one-directional statement.

I agreed with your general doubt whether the proposal is TRT.  My
motivation is somewhat different.

> > Why isn't that a better approach?  I don't think it's wise to blur the
> > difference between using project.el features and the VC back-end
> > features that support them.  If someone wants to use project.el in VC
> > commands, let them use project.el commands, not VC commands.  That
> > way, Emacs will know that some kind of project is being worked on, and
> > could offer more targeted support for such users.
> 
> Not sure that's going to result in optimal user experience. After all, 
> simply having a copy of every command, but acting on a project, would 
> make it 2x the number of commands.
> 
> And project-rgrep, on the other hand, would probably search the current 
> project root without prompting. Unlike the proposed change to rgrep, 
> which only makes it a suggestion.

I just fear that this is a slippery slope: we will eventually need to
inject this into many GP commands, "for consistency".

> Another long-term violation of your idea is the default definition of 
> xref-backend-references. It uses the current project. You could say that 
> mixes up abstractions as well, but it's just too handy to implement this 
> way.

I don't think I understand the issue and the use case, sorry.