reconsider defaults custom group

reconsider defaults custom group

[Alex Schroeder]

Patrick Anderson posted a nice customization group for newbies on
http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?ReconsiderDefaults

Was there not a thread a long time ago about building such a list?
Now at least we have a starting point.

Alex.



Here it is:

;;; reconsider-defaults.el --- reconsider default emacs settings.
;;; Commentary:

;; type
;; M-x eval-buffer RET
;; M-x reconsider-defaults RET
;; this will create a "customization" buffer used to make permanent changes to emacs behavior

;;; Code:

(defgroup reconsider-defaults nil
  :group 'emacs)

(defun reconsider-defaults ()
  "reconsider default emacs settings."
  (interactive)
  (mapcar (lambda (var)
			(custom-add-to-group 'reconsider-defaults var 'custom-variable))
		  '(
			confirm-kill-emacs
			global-font-lock-mode
			iswitchb-mode
			auto-compression-mode
			suggest-key-bindings
			transient-mark-mode
			dired-recursive-copies
			dired-recursive-deletes

			blink-cursor
			x-stretch-cursor
			show-paren-mode
			show-trailing-whitespace
			desktop-enable
			display-time-mode

			display-time-day-and-date
			display-time-format
			display-time-mode
			hs-isearch-open

			view-diary-entries-initially



			apropos-do-all
			winner-mode

			tab-stop-list
			tab-width

			enable-recursive-minibuffers

			woman-use-own-frame

			blink-cursor-delay
			blink-cursor-interval
			blink-matching-paren-dont-ignore-comments

			eol-mnemonic-mac
			eol-mnemonic-undecided
			eol-mnemonic-unix

			archive-zip-use-pkzip
			auto-save-list-file-prefix

			user-full-name
			user-mail-address

			global-hl-line-mode

			bookmark-bmenu-toggle-filenames
			bookmark-sort-flag
			browse-url-browser-function

			c-default-style
			c-echo-syntactic-information-p
			c-mode-common-hook
			case-fold-search
			column-number-mode
			completion-ignored-extensions

			delete-selection-mode

			diary-file
			diary-hook
			dired-at-point-require-prefix

			ediff-diff-options
			ediff-window-setup-function

			emacs-lisp-mode-hook
			emacs-wiki-downcase-title-words
			emacs-wiki-highlight-markup

			eshell-buffer-maximum-lines
			eshell-cmpl-man-function
			eshell-directory-name
			eshell-force-execution
			eshell-group-file
			eshell-hosts-file
			eshell-interpreter-alist
			eshell-ls-archive-regexp
			eshell-ls-dired-initial-args
			eshell-ls-highlight-alist
			eshell-ls-initial-args
			eshell-ls-product-regexp
			eshell-ls-use-in-dired
			eshell-passwd-file
			eshell-send-direct-to-subprocesses

			flyspell-default-dictionary

			font-lock-maximum-size

			generic-define-unix-modes

			gnus-asynchronous
			gnus-default-directory
			gnus-group-list-inactive-groups
			gnus-home-directory
			gnus-large-newsgroup
			gnus-message-archive-group
			gnus-use-cache
			gnus-use-dribble-file

			gud-cdb-directories
			gud-chdir-before-run

			hi-lock-mode

			highlight-changes-active-string
			highlight-changes-global-changes-existing-buffers
			highlight-changes-passive-string

			hippie-expand-try-functions-list ;(define-key global-map [(meta ?/)] 'hippie-expand)

			htmlize-html-major-mode

			isearch-lazy-highlight-cleanup
			isearch-lazy-highlight-initial-delay
			isearch-lazy-highlight-max-at-a-time

			ls-lisp-emulation
			ls-lisp-ignore-case
			ls-lisp-verbosity

			mail-host-address
			mail-source-crash-box
			mail-source-directory
			mail-user-agent

			make-backup-files
			mark-diary-entries-in-calendar
			mark-holidays-in-calendar

			max-specpdl-size

			message-directory
			message-log-max
			message-send-mail-function

			mmm-global-mode
			mmm-major-mode-preferences
			mmm-mode-ext-classes-alist

			mode-line-format

			mouse-wheel-mode

			next-line-add-newlines
			next-screen-context-lines
			nnmail-message-id-cache-file

			parens-require-spaces

			read-quoted-char-radix

			resize-minibuffer-mode

			scroll-bar-mode
			scroll-preserve-screen-position

			send-mail-function

			shell-file-name

			smtpmail-auth-credentials
			smtpmail-debug-info
			smtpmail-default-smtp-server
			smtpmail-local-domain
			smtpmail-queue-dir
			smtpmail-smtp-server

			tags-revert-without-query
			tramp-debug-buffer

			uniquify-buffer-name-style

			url-cache-directory
			url-cookie-file
			url-global-history-file
			url-global-history-save-interval
			url-keep-history

			vc-default-back-end

			w3m-bookmark-file
			w3m-default-save-directory
			w3m-fill-column
			w3m-key-binding
			w3m-local-directory-view-method
			w3m-search-default-engine
			w3m-use-header-line

			ange-ftp-dumb-unix-host-regexp
			ange-ftp-generate-anonymous-password
			appt-message-warning-time
			))
  (customize-group 'reconsider-defaults))
;;; reconsider-defaults.el ends here

Re: reconsider defaults custom group

[Miles Bader]

How are all those particular variables related to each other?  Why the
odd name (`Reconsider Defaults' sounds as if it's trying to give you a
2nd chance before you change something, which is a decidedly odd concept
in Customize, since it's a generally declarative interface!)?

-Miles
-- 
Occam's razor split hairs so well, I bought the whole argument!

Re: reconsider defaults custom group

[Richard Stallman]

I think this is useful, but I agree that `reconsider-defaults' is a
strange and unnatural name for it.  `basic' or `popular-options'
would be much better.

Do you think some of these options should have different defaults?
Would you like to propose 4 options to change the defauls of?
(If you told me a long list, I could not think about them all.)

Re: reconsider defaults custom group

[patware]

> I think this is useful, but I agree that `reconsider-defaults' is a
> strange and unnatural name for it.  `basic' or `popular-options' would
> be much better.
>
> Do you think some of these options should have different defaults? Would
> you like to propose 4 options to change the defauls of?
> (If you told me a long list, I could not think about them all.)

i care nothing about the name.  the title reflects my relation to EMACS
development (outside of it).  the meaning is/was "as a user i want to
reconsider this editors default values".

the list is available here
http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?ReconsiderDefaults and is
(beginning to be) sorted by order of severity.  severity means "variables
that the community considers incorrectly defaulted"

Re: reconsider defaults custom group

[Richard Stallman]

If you think some of these options should have different defaults,
would you please mention 4 such options, and for each one explain why
you think it should be changed?  I can consider a few such issues.

Re: reconsider defaults custom group

[Patrick Anderson]

> I think this is useful, but I agree that `reconsider-defaults'' is a
> strange and unnatural name for it.  `basic'' or `popular-options'' would
> be much better.
> 
> Do you think some of these options should have different defaults? Would
> you like to propose 4 options to change the defauls of?
> (If you told me a long list, I could not think about them all.)

i care nothing about the name.  the title reflects my relation to EMACS development (outside of it).  the meaning is/was "as a user i want to reconsider this editor's default values".

the list is available here http://www.emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?ReconsiderDefaults and is (beginning to be) sorted by order of severity.  severity means "variables that the community considers incorrectly defaulted"

patrick

Re: reconsider defaults custom group

[Kim F. Storm]

Patrick Anderson <panderson@altiris.com> writes:

> > I think this is useful, but I agree that `reconsider-defaults'' is a
> > strange and unnatural name for it.  `basic'' or `popular-options'' would
> > be much better.
> > 
> > Do you think some of these options should have different defaults? Would
> > you like to propose 4 options to change the defauls of?
> > (If you told me a long list, I could not think about them all.)
> 

Below is the list copied from the URL above.  It has this intro:

        emacs can be difficult to use out of the box 
        this is mostly for those climbing the steep curve of this religion 
        please sort by severity 

I personally agree that several of the listed options could have
better defaults for the novice (and expert) emacs user.

* confirm-kill-emacs
* global-font-lock-mode
* iswitchb-mode
* ido-mode  (new in 21.4)
* cua-mode  (new in 21.4)
* auto-compression-mode
* suggest-key-bindings
* transient-mark-mode
* dired-recursive-copies
* dired-recursive-deletes

* blink-cursor
* x-stretch-cursor
* show-paren-mode
* show-trailing-whitespace
* desktop-enable
* display-time-mode

* display-time-day-and-date
* display-time-format
* display-time-mode
* hs-isearch-open

* view-diary-entries-initially

* apropos-do-all
* winner-mode

* tab-stop-list
* tab-width

* enable-recursive-minibuffers

* woman-use-own-frame

* blink-cursor-delay
* blink-cursor-interval
* blink-matching-paren-dont-ignore-comments

* eol-mnemonic-mac
* eol-mnemonic-undecided
* eol-mnemonic-unix

* archive-zip-use-pkzip
* auto-save-list-file-prefix

* user-full-name
* user-mail-address

* global-hl-line-mode

* bookmark-bmenu-toggle-filenames
* bookmark-sort-flag
* browse-url-browser-function

* c-default-style
* c-echo-syntactic-information-p
* c-mode-common-hook
* case-fold-search
* column-number-mode
* completion-ignored-extensions

* delete-selection-mode

* diary-file
* diary-hook
* dired-at-point-require-prefix

* ediff-diff-options
* ediff-window-setup-function

* emacs-lisp-mode-hook
* emacs-wiki-downcase-title-words
* emacs-wiki-highlight-markup

* eshell-buffer-maximum-lines
* eshell-cmpl-man-function
* eshell-directory-name
* eshell-force-execution
* eshell-group-file
* eshell-hosts-file
* eshell-interpreter-alist
* eshell-ls-archive-regexp
* eshell-ls-dired-initial-args
* eshell-ls-highlight-alist
* eshell-ls-initial-args
* eshell-ls-product-regexp
* eshell-ls-use-in-dired
* eshell-passwd-file
* eshell-send-direct-to-subprocesses

* flyspell-default-dictionary

* font-lock-maximum-size

* generic-define-unix-modes

* gnus-asynchronous
* gnus-default-directory
* gnus-group-list-inactive-groups
* gnus-home-directory
* gnus-large-newsgroup
* gnus-message-archive-group
* gnus-use-cache
* gnus-use-dribble-file

* gud-cdb-directories
* gud-chdir-before-run

* hi-lock-mode

* highlight-changes-active-string
* highlight-changes-global-changes-existing-buffers
* highlight-changes-passive-string

* hippie-expand-try-functions-list ;(define-key global-map [(meta ?/)] 'hippie-expand)

* htmlize-html-major-mode

* isearch-lazy-highlight-cleanup
* isearch-lazy-highlight-initial-delay
* isearch-lazy-highlight-max-at-a-time

* ls-lisp-emulation
* ls-lisp-ignore-case
* ls-lisp-verbosity

* mail-host-address
* mail-source-crash-box
* mail-source-directory
* mail-user-agent

* make-backup-files
* mark-diary-entries-in-calendar
* mark-holidays-in-calendar

* max-specpdl-size

* message-directory
* message-log-max
* message-send-mail-function

* mmm-global-mode
* mmm-major-mode-preferences
* mmm-mode-ext-classes-alist

* mode-line-format

* mouse-wheel-mode

* next-line-add-newlines
* next-screen-context-lines
* nnmail-message-id-cache-file

* parens-require-spaces

* read-quoted-char-radix

* resize-minibuffer-mode

* scroll-bar-mode
* scroll-preserve-screen-position

* send-mail-function

* shell-file-name

* smtpmail-auth-credentials
* smtpmail-debug-info
* smtpmail-default-smtp-server
* smtpmail-local-domain
* smtpmail-queue-dir
* smtpmail-smtp-server

* tags-revert-without-query
* tramp-debug-buffer

* uniquify-buffer-name-style

* url-cache-directory
* url-cookie-file
* url-global-history-file
* url-global-history-save-interval
* url-keep-history

* vc-default-back-end

* w3m-bookmark-file
* w3m-default-save-directory
* w3m-fill-column
* w3m-key-binding
* w3m-local-directory-view-method
* w3m-search-default-engine
* w3m-use-header-line

* ange-ftp-dumb-unix-host-regexp
* ange-ftp-generate-anonymous-password
* appt-message-warning-time

Re: reconsider defaults custom group

[Richard Stallman]

    I personally agree that several of the listed options could have
    better defaults for the novice (and expert) emacs user.

I cannot think about these changes en masse.  Would you like to pick
just a few of them, and we can discuss them one by one?

Re: reconsider defaults custom group

[Alex Schroeder]

Richard Stallman <rms@gnu.org> writes:

>     I personally agree that several of the listed options could have
>     better defaults for the novice (and expert) emacs user.
>
> I cannot think about these changes en masse.  Would you like to pick
> just a few of them, and we can discuss them one by one?

Some of us are currently discussing a list of options on the wiki; we
will get back to you with a small number of defaults we suggest to
change, and a list of options we would like to put in a "newbies"
group (and hopefully with a good name for that group, too).

Alex.

Re: reconsider defaults custom group

[Richard Stallman]

    Some of us are currently discussing a list of options on the wiki; we
    will get back to you with a small number of defaults we suggest to
    change,

Thanks.  It's conceivable I might agree instantly with changing some
options, but more likely I'll want to see arguments in favor of it.

Re: reconsider defaults custom group

[Patrick Anderson]

please see http://emacswiki.org/cgi-bin/wiki.pl?PopularOptions for the most recent community-changed results.

-----Original Message-----
From: Kim F. Storm [mailto:no-spam@cua.dk]
Sent: Friday, January 03, 2003 5:19 PM
To: Patrick Anderson
Cc: rms@gnu.org; alex@emacswiki.org; emacs-devel@gnu.org
Subject: Re: reconsider defaults custom group


Patrick Anderson <panderson@altiris.com> writes:

> > I think this is useful, but I agree that `reconsider-defaults'' is a
> > strange and unnatural name for it.  `basic'' or `popular-options'' would
> > be much better.
> > 
> > Do you think some of these options should have different defaults? Would
> > you like to propose 4 options to change the defauls of?
> > (If you told me a long list, I could not think about them all.)
> 

Below is the list copied from the URL above.  It has this intro:

        emacs can be difficult to use out of the box 
        this is mostly for those climbing the steep curve of this religion 
        please sort by severity 

I personally agree that several of the listed options could have
better defaults for the novice (and expert) emacs user.

* confirm-kill-emacs
* global-font-lock-mode
* iswitchb-mode
* ido-mode  (new in 21.4)
* cua-mode  (new in 21.4)
* auto-compression-mode
* suggest-key-bindings
* transient-mark-mode
* dired-recursive-copies
* dired-recursive-deletes

* blink-cursor
* x-stretch-cursor
* show-paren-mode
* show-trailing-whitespace
* desktop-enable
* display-time-mode

* display-time-day-and-date
* display-time-format
* display-time-mode
* hs-isearch-open

* view-diary-entries-initially

* apropos-do-all
* winner-mode

* tab-stop-list
* tab-width

* enable-recursive-minibuffers

* woman-use-own-frame

* blink-cursor-delay
* blink-cursor-interval
* blink-matching-paren-dont-ignore-comments

* eol-mnemonic-mac
* eol-mnemonic-undecided
* eol-mnemonic-unix

* archive-zip-use-pkzip
* auto-save-list-file-prefix

* user-full-name
* user-mail-address

* global-hl-line-mode

* bookmark-bmenu-toggle-filenames
* bookmark-sort-flag
* browse-url-browser-function

* c-default-style
* c-echo-syntactic-information-p
* c-mode-common-hook
* case-fold-search
* column-number-mode
* completion-ignored-extensions

* delete-selection-mode

* diary-file
* diary-hook
* dired-at-point-require-prefix

* ediff-diff-options
* ediff-window-setup-function

* emacs-lisp-mode-hook
* emacs-wiki-downcase-title-words
* emacs-wiki-highlight-markup

* eshell-buffer-maximum-lines
* eshell-cmpl-man-function
* eshell-directory-name
* eshell-force-execution
* eshell-group-file
* eshell-hosts-file
* eshell-interpreter-alist
* eshell-ls-archive-regexp
* eshell-ls-dired-initial-args
* eshell-ls-highlight-alist
* eshell-ls-initial-args
* eshell-ls-product-regexp
* eshell-ls-use-in-dired
* eshell-passwd-file
* eshell-send-direct-to-subprocesses

* flyspell-default-dictionary

* font-lock-maximum-size

* generic-define-unix-modes

* gnus-asynchronous
* gnus-default-directory
* gnus-group-list-inactive-groups
* gnus-home-directory
* gnus-large-newsgroup
* gnus-message-archive-group
* gnus-use-cache
* gnus-use-dribble-file

* gud-cdb-directories
* gud-chdir-before-run

* hi-lock-mode

* highlight-changes-active-string
* highlight-changes-global-changes-existing-buffers
* highlight-changes-passive-string

* hippie-expand-try-functions-list ;(define-key global-map [(meta ?/)] 'hippie-expand)

* htmlize-html-major-mode

* isearch-lazy-highlight-cleanup
* isearch-lazy-highlight-initial-delay
* isearch-lazy-highlight-max-at-a-time

* ls-lisp-emulation
* ls-lisp-ignore-case
* ls-lisp-verbosity

* mail-host-address
* mail-source-crash-box
* mail-source-directory
* mail-user-agent

* make-backup-files
* mark-diary-entries-in-calendar
* mark-holidays-in-calendar

* max-specpdl-size

* message-directory
* message-log-max
* message-send-mail-function

* mmm-global-mode
* mmm-major-mode-preferences
* mmm-mode-ext-classes-alist

* mode-line-format

* mouse-wheel-mode

* next-line-add-newlines
* next-screen-context-lines
* nnmail-message-id-cache-file

* parens-require-spaces

* read-quoted-char-radix

* resize-minibuffer-mode

* scroll-bar-mode
* scroll-preserve-screen-position

* send-mail-function

* shell-file-name

* smtpmail-auth-credentials
* smtpmail-debug-info
* smtpmail-default-smtp-server
* smtpmail-local-domain
* smtpmail-queue-dir
* smtpmail-smtp-server

* tags-revert-without-query
* tramp-debug-buffer

* uniquify-buffer-name-style

* url-cache-directory
* url-cookie-file
* url-global-history-file
* url-global-history-save-interval
* url-keep-history

* vc-default-back-end

* w3m-bookmark-file
* w3m-default-save-directory
* w3m-fill-column
* w3m-key-binding
* w3m-local-directory-view-method
* w3m-search-default-engine
* w3m-use-header-line

* ange-ftp-dumb-unix-host-regexp
* ange-ftp-generate-anonymous-password
* appt-message-warning-time

Re: reconsider defaults custom group

[Patrick Anderson]

to clarify:

i was never interested in actually changing the defaults.  that may be useful for some of these, but was not my intention.

when it comes to default options the high-level goal for any product should be to satisfy the most people.  but some options are chosen equally both directions.  that means a default cannot be meaningfully chosen.

that is why i think popular-options.el should always be a part of the editor.  a link from the welcome page could say something like "click to edit popularly changed options.".  the displayed customization list should be sorted by those options which most equally split the community.




-----Original Message-----
From: Richard Stallman [mailto:rms@gnu.org]
Sent: Sunday, January 05, 2003 8:25 PM
To: alex@emacswiki.org
Cc: kfs@cua.dk; Patrick Anderson; emacs-devel@gnu.org
Subject: Re: reconsider defaults custom group


    Some of us are currently discussing a list of options on the wiki; we
    will get back to you with a small number of defaults we suggest to
    change,

Thanks.  It's conceivable I might agree instantly with changing some
options, but more likely I'll want to see arguments in favor of it.

Re: reconsider defaults custom group

[Richard Stallman]

I agree that it's useful to have a "popular things to change" custom
group.  Thanks for working on that, and I would be glad to install
a patch or a new file to set it up.

At the same time, if people want to argue for changing a few specific
options' defaults, I am interested in thinking about it.