From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Dave Pawson" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: My emacs was upgraded and I am a novice again Date: Sun, 23 Sep 2007 09:56:08 +0100 Message-ID: <711a73df0709230156h337dc87cw60a1f40a68b7c4df@mail.gmail.com> References: <46F2BA57.3060604@gmail.com> <87fy16q8kq.fsf@lion.rapttech.com.au> <85myvdre11.fsf@lola.goethe.zz> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1190537804 31718 80.91.229.12 (23 Sep 2007 08:56:44 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 23 Sep 2007 08:56:44 +0000 (UTC) To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sun Sep 23 10:56:38 2007 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1IZNGX-0004at-Tf for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sun, 23 Sep 2007 10:56:38 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1IZNGU-0000Eo-Vc for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sun, 23 Sep 2007 04:56:35 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1IZNG8-0000EW-Ap for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 23 Sep 2007 04:56:12 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1IZNG7-0000E0-9W for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 23 Sep 2007 04:56:11 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1IZNG7-0000Dw-65 for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 23 Sep 2007 04:56:11 -0400 Original-Received: from rv-out-0910.google.com ([209.85.198.184]) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1IZNG6-0004iz-Q7 for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 23 Sep 2007 04:56:10 -0400 Original-Received: by rv-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id c27so1089176rvf for ; Sun, 23 Sep 2007 01:56:09 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; bh=bwjUaHn1Gf3bGg8xV84Zw+MPRgHxUh4GNUldJJhEYC0=; b=ssq+pTA7nj78T0KJW4O/ygBLOxCj9Z4hXEjF3zdysrLYU+nCXbk3GRq28A1o7AIts7pm+Lb3SdnDcQO+CIudTVhRO9v+hRog/vYWRFio/a+KCoP3MrkPo0YdPn1QrFHDEG43NeSUgO2qJFa6B8grefFVdwPOx8ErFU0yrHMKDkY= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=WLp/9V9mz2Ar/MvMRSvEB+q1lHeKDFiwKrmn8i/XFPdpFbvc8s9Z4KivmRb76wiA2XJahk46IZACcC8avegzgJ/lhaSl3Qxbcaiq1466FRbzXBhErP2QekY160zHYd/LFX9szU214a2G7jkj+3/3lVhsFuPczTOEY8ywhK2g900= Original-Received: by 10.141.129.14 with SMTP id g14mr1320546rvn.1190537768458; Sun, 23 Sep 2007 01:56:08 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: by 10.141.69.5 with HTTP; Sun, 23 Sep 2007 01:56:08 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <85myvdre11.fsf@lola.goethe.zz> Content-Disposition: inline X-Detected-Kernel: Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:47757 Archived-At: On 23/09/2007, David Kastrup wrote: > Then perhaps it would be time to get acquainted with the documentation > system of Emacs. I agree David. I am. From the .texi files as my starting point. > If you have not found the information, it is because you did not even > think of asking Emacs for it. The "Help" menu is there for a purpose. I think I'm beginning to see that. And just how complete it is, from Tim and other peoples input. btw, Eli has agreed to add the reload term to the docs as another way into 'revert'. > > > Yes, another index, presuming familiarity with the oddities of > > texinfo. Eli tells me that it is the official policy of gnu. I find > > that archaic. > > A working fast and efficient tool that is easy to use is not lightly > replaced. Hammers might be archaic tools, but they still do the job > of driving nails. Not sure of the analogy, but I'd suggest the comparator might be a branch of a tree rather than a modern hammer. The only part I find objectionable is having to bend the way I work to an archaic tool. > > > http://savannah.gnu.org/search/index.php?type_of_search=soft&words=%%% > > there isn't even a general gnu documentation list, seems that > > texinfo is a given and not open to a challenge. > > There is no working challenge around. HTML does not contain useful > indexing and structuring information. I believe there is. XML, not html. utf-8/16 encoding. Semantic markup way beyond what .texi can do, structured, encoding, fully supported by transforms etc. Eli points out the low likelihood of gnu adopting XML as a documentation system, which I can see. http://docbook2x.sourceforge.net/ even provides the transform so that Tim and others can continue to use the texi system. What you'd do with the Euro (€) I'm less sure, but perhaps there aren't any non-English speaking emacs users? regards -- Dave Pawson XSLT XSL-FO FAQ. http://www.dpawson.co.uk