From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Dave Pawson" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: My emacs was upgraded and I am a novice again Date: Sun, 23 Sep 2007 08:18:14 +0100 Message-ID: <711a73df0709230018q30ef3c6fg217fadbf75c955fb@mail.gmail.com> References: <46F2BA57.3060604@gmail.com> <87tzplq5zs.fsf@lion.rapttech.com.au> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1190531919 19566 80.91.229.12 (23 Sep 2007 07:18:39 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 23 Sep 2007 07:18:39 +0000 (UTC) To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sun Sep 23 09:18:34 2007 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1IZLje-0002dP-8U for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sun, 23 Sep 2007 09:18:34 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1IZLjb-0006GE-Cf for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Sun, 23 Sep 2007 03:18:31 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1IZLjN-0006G1-S5 for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 23 Sep 2007 03:18:17 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1IZLjM-0006Fi-Ga for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 23 Sep 2007 03:18:17 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1IZLjM-0006Ff-9z for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 23 Sep 2007 03:18:16 -0400 Original-Received: from rv-out-0910.google.com ([209.85.198.190]) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1IZLjM-0000HB-0a for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Sun, 23 Sep 2007 03:18:16 -0400 Original-Received: by rv-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id c27so1084674rvf for ; Sun, 23 Sep 2007 00:18:15 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=domainkey-signature:received:received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; bh=4gbIy9rFKivUpFFK4uwqRseZiu8EqOwntXvVIwgsA/4=; b=Sz7gHfpskLvgoVOnYWwHjP790eLkHh7ktafOTr0AYDSzqgzb7ZRJxyHShQuGbsdLQzFeP+8SAB1nuMfBgQ3R/3mOmsXC6C4u2irzemqfeFcZY8W2j7G3m09kZSE/RREZuOUFHb976CSMDNwEZrofgtoDbQlcs1MbcoSgLqqpBAk= DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; c=nofws; d=gmail.com; s=beta; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=QapfcZQWxaqxSiTU0qgmq0ei80iiM9PJ+ZL8nG2FZXKdrvjV6As85ILrgpPbjvPyMC1lYve+s3rSf23zn/093NH7Cbqs1E9cHdn7l5pxDwpkJjRzYMOdxGH3mVMew/MENZEfYddHARLeRoBI8Buz69QuCETt35KdzAkAoweH9AI= Original-Received: by 10.141.177.2 with SMTP id e2mr1241381rvp.1190531894934; Sun, 23 Sep 2007 00:18:14 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: by 10.141.69.5 with HTTP; Sun, 23 Sep 2007 00:18:14 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <87tzplq5zs.fsf@lion.rapttech.com.au> Content-Disposition: inline X-Detected-Kernel: Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:47752 Archived-At: On 23/09/2007, Tim X wrote: > This doesn't mean it isn't a good idea to try alternatives that may help > overcome this limitation of spoken language. My recommendation would be to > put a page up on the emacs wiki. This would allow others, possibly from > different backgrounds or for whom english is a second language, to add > additional entries, examples or clarification. I find the emacs wiki a > great resource and often spend a few hours browsing it and learning new > techniques/ideas. Often, this involves using features I was aware of, but > in ways I had not considered. OK. good a place as any Tim. Thanks. > > The only request I would make is to please include links to the relevant > manual entry rather than re-write or re-do what is in the manual. That's my problem Tim. I don't know whats in the manual, simply because I find it hard to use. One of > the biggest areas of confusion that I see with emacs is all the out of date > pages that advise people to do exactly the wrong thing. These pages are > seldom as up-to-date as the emacs manual. I'm suggesting that the manual be available fully in navigable html, derived from an XML master. The info files could be similarly derived. There's a lot more experience of I18N use in XML than in texinfo I'd guess. Eli pointed out that the actual elisp files contain bits which are used in the manual. My proposal there was, as the lisp is being packaged for delivery, the 'bits' needed in the elisp be 'included', by some sort of pre-processing step (what's the elisp for #include?) such that *all* documentation is single sourced for translation and use in all formats. regards -- Dave Pawson XSLT XSL-FO FAQ. http://www.dpawson.co.uk