From: Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com>
To: "Mattias Engdegård" <mattiase@acm.org>, "Richard Stallman" <rms@gnu.org>
Cc: Michael Heerdegen <michael_heerdegen@web.de>,
ke.vigouroux@laposte.net, eggert@cs.ucla.edu,
40671@debbugs.gnu.org
Subject: bug#40671: [DOC] modify literal objects
Date: Fri, 24 Apr 2020 10:18:33 -0700 (PDT) [thread overview]
Message-ID: <68ef2c1e-0b60-4a9d-b781-4dabf71a6e7f@default> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <AD065A65-4EC5-4C61-BEFE-9E2FAB2E597C@acm.org>
> > It seems strange to use the terms "constant" and "mutable" to
> > describe whether modifying its contents is something you had
> > better avoid. I think people will find that terminology
> > confusing. Normally "mutable" means that you CAN change it,
> > not that it is OK to change it.
>
> What is the difference between CANNOT and
> SHOULD NOT, operationally? To the user, nothing; there is no gain from
> disobeying our advice.
No. To the user: something. And the negative
effects might not be immediately noticeable.
If we say that you can't modify XYZ there's no
need for you to pay attention, learn about the
gotcha, and try to avoid modifying XYZ.
The burden here is on the user (unfortunately).
Emacs Lisp doesn't protect you from doing what
you'd be told you "cannot" do. It's up to you
to know when you might be stumbling onto this
pitfall and avoid it.
Telling users they _can't_ fall into this pit
is like telling someone it's impossible for their
car to go through a red light. Nope, they're the
driver, and the message should be, "Don't drive
through a red light."
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2020-04-24 17:18 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 170+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2020-04-16 19:28 bug#40671: [DOC] modify literal objects Kevin Vigouroux via Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors
2020-04-17 16:09 ` Mattias Engdegård
2020-04-17 16:37 ` Mattias Engdegård
2020-04-17 17:27 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-18 20:10 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-18 21:54 ` Drew Adams
2020-04-19 2:39 ` Noam Postavsky
2020-04-19 20:39 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-19 21:01 ` Drew Adams
2020-04-19 21:16 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-19 22:24 ` Drew Adams
2020-04-19 22:51 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-20 5:32 ` Drew Adams
2020-04-22 17:36 ` Paul Eggert
2020-05-01 3:03 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-01 5:16 ` Drew Adams
2020-05-01 21:46 ` Paul Eggert
2020-05-01 23:37 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-19 2:26 ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-19 13:56 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-19 16:59 ` Mattias Engdegård
2020-04-19 19:21 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-19 21:02 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-19 21:11 ` Drew Adams
2020-04-19 21:57 ` Michael Heerdegen
2020-04-19 22:41 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-19 23:45 ` Michael Heerdegen
2020-04-20 0:24 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-20 0:53 ` Michael Heerdegen
2020-04-20 3:23 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-20 3:36 ` Michael Heerdegen
2020-04-22 6:30 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-20 5:54 ` Drew Adams
2020-04-22 17:21 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-23 0:49 ` Michael Heerdegen
2020-04-24 2:36 ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-24 15:08 ` Drew Adams
2020-04-25 1:58 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-24 16:39 ` Mattias Engdegård
2020-04-24 16:46 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-25 2:21 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-25 2:40 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-25 3:20 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-25 19:30 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-26 3:49 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-26 14:03 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-26 14:19 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-26 14:34 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-26 15:46 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-26 16:02 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-26 16:58 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-26 17:39 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-26 18:14 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-26 18:32 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-26 18:41 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-26 18:53 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-26 18:57 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-26 19:22 ` Philipp Stephani
2020-04-26 20:14 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-26 21:23 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-26 23:13 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-27 0:53 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-27 1:49 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-28 3:05 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-28 8:17 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-28 13:54 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-28 17:59 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-28 18:46 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-28 19:20 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-28 19:33 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-28 20:09 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-28 21:10 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-28 23:10 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-28 23:36 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-28 23:53 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-28 23:57 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-28 23:53 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-29 0:04 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-29 0:14 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-29 0:55 ` Drew Adams
2020-04-29 1:03 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-29 1:15 ` Drew Adams
2020-04-29 1:27 ` Michael Heerdegen
2020-04-29 1:38 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-29 4:36 ` Drew Adams
2020-04-29 16:18 ` Paul Eggert
2020-05-01 2:47 ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-01 6:23 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-05-01 3:13 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-01 5:15 ` Drew Adams
2020-05-01 21:40 ` Paul Eggert
2020-05-01 22:05 ` Drew Adams
2020-05-01 22:28 ` Paul Eggert
2020-05-02 1:07 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-02 6:28 ` Paul Eggert
2020-05-02 15:42 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-02 19:35 ` Paul Eggert
2020-05-03 1:30 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-03 7:40 ` Paul Eggert
2020-05-03 16:44 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-03 20:48 ` Paul Eggert
2020-05-03 22:17 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-03 22:18 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-03 22:39 ` Paul Eggert
2020-05-03 22:53 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-03 23:10 ` Paul Eggert
2020-05-04 10:16 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-04 17:52 ` Paul Eggert
2020-05-05 1:39 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-05 6:09 ` Paul Eggert
2020-05-05 12:38 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-09 6:10 ` Paul Eggert
2020-05-10 3:13 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-10 13:34 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-10 17:29 ` Paul Eggert
2020-05-11 0:00 ` Michael Heerdegen
2020-05-11 0:26 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-11 1:47 ` Drew Adams
2020-05-11 1:54 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-11 2:33 ` Drew Adams
2020-05-11 2:56 ` Michael Heerdegen
2020-05-11 4:21 ` Drew Adams
2020-05-11 4:51 ` Michael Heerdegen
2020-05-11 6:28 ` Paul Eggert
2020-05-11 13:57 ` Noam Postavsky
2020-05-11 22:36 ` Michael Heerdegen
2020-05-11 22:30 ` Michael Heerdegen
2020-05-12 3:20 ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-12 4:24 ` Michael Heerdegen
2020-05-13 3:57 ` Richard Stallman
2020-05-13 5:05 ` Michael Heerdegen
2020-05-14 5:14 ` Richard Stallman
[not found] ` <05BEF593-F16A-4DEE-98BC-653221F1F9EE@acm.org>
2020-05-17 0:11 ` Paul Eggert
2020-05-17 9:43 ` Mattias Engdegård
2020-05-17 16:38 ` Paul Eggert
2020-05-11 1:53 ` Paul Eggert
2020-05-11 3:18 ` Michael Heerdegen
2020-05-11 0:44 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-11 1:57 ` Paul Eggert
2020-05-12 1:59 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-17 1:28 ` Paul Eggert
2020-05-17 5:02 ` Michael Heerdegen
2020-05-17 16:34 ` Paul Eggert
2020-05-17 12:39 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-17 16:21 ` Paul Eggert
2020-05-05 17:40 ` Drew Adams
2020-05-05 18:49 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-05-05 19:26 ` Drew Adams
2020-05-05 20:48 ` Kevin Vigouroux via Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors
2020-05-09 5:57 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-28 21:18 ` Dmitry Gutov
2020-04-28 17:25 ` Drew Adams
2020-04-28 17:47 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-29 0:32 ` Michael Heerdegen
2020-04-29 1:40 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-29 4:40 ` Michael Heerdegen
2020-04-29 8:01 ` Eli Zaretskii
2020-04-29 16:36 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-24 17:18 ` Drew Adams [this message]
2020-04-25 3:38 ` Richard Stallman
2020-04-25 18:26 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-25 2:22 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-25 6:00 ` Andreas Schwab
2020-04-25 18:23 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-28 23:52 ` Michael Heerdegen
2020-04-21 1:25 ` Michael Heerdegen
2020-04-21 2:20 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-20 6:02 ` Drew Adams
2020-04-19 20:45 ` Paul Eggert
2020-04-20 14:10 ` Eli Zaretskii
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