From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Clive Tovero Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: GNU Emacs raison d'etre Date: Sun, 9 Aug 2020 13:11:33 -0400 Message-ID: <64c4b2e4-3c07-0ad4-bcdf-39e95cae8a57@aol.com> References: <64c4b2e4-3c07-0ad4-bcdf-39e95cae8a57.ref@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="19302"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.10.0 To: arthur.miller@live.com, Emacs , rms@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun Aug 09 19:12:21 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1k4ort-0004tL-Di for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 09 Aug 2020 19:12:21 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:39600 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1k4ors-0006vb-F1 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 09 Aug 2020 13:12:20 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:42482) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1k4orI-0006Nf-F4 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 09 Aug 2020 13:11:44 -0400 Original-Received: from sonic306-21.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com ([66.163.189.83]:45991) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1k4orE-0003YN-GB for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 09 Aug 2020 13:11:44 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=aol.com; s=a2048; t=1596993098; bh=I1pc5ZmfxCiUAgxgq5PEGZXPgI2vnv6+sC9c9CxLioc=; h=To:From:Subject:Date:References:From:Subject; b=JhzN5Cb41O1n2CEHCKh4aMReFaLp49E9JAdxK/vPoggC5KQSIb3NbpUh6g83lxsF8abGm5DiTStpsMEpItodtTaqlAw3sviYXQh06sUmZzVIfTFx9/ehZXamEdKZchFzoGKxGdDLuvAAyETv55reqe/GopFvjTi9ia7lwnYwm9m0zA4FUb2whoz4SE6oyZh1tKeyERcpMoESrpmR/yS9ru7VrZ11fC4kvbwOO7oaEPHlhf4lhJsFkZ4nDvSun46oEl9SMkCJC83jTldZtb7XzeqXZAlKdPXmj5Qam/WEjbed4Csfww0llgodxIYjmAnx3sLWr+rFoo297C/lKwWvnQ== X-YMail-OSG: VbkabzUVM1mXcwdMHg9NOCe3hgjSttj.BJRk.qS7NYhOUC4v2HDRlHmzM49e7tk .lg_me8rrEYFr56Ci2Y1CIps1hi4SIoUoKncY_MdxUWh4CViQAOtE8TVZVLtIP0PoO65s_LciVS6 .nzNHLOnUli8n.xPwBENAMHzkKgcU6LJmTkH5MwhacSOK7frEonxtprdSVPsDNc68CyURB6E68eh TPUbQ5ZEiBRnm5GKHNByqsz3myUa4Ybh7HdFKUI4g2w4585zx5QTit5uBLSUIfYj2Mg9Dwih6wXg 1RRjZhxmsPcl1HGg.5_.KncybjqxKiYze0frX8WjsmKuhlX73BsYEEJwUJLpM7awm9QVsNBnM4RO dirWKV.GiZ0KC8_34cPzqBybpixE_T8Tawmsarqk5vrmw8X7tDRY6Vl2Js5acW1rYbMNPMSLn7DD crugiLJA59ELvRd0VY8n0G4pHGR82L8SRdBp7Sh._0xUOc0w_HzhULiymUfjFEqtRbjpYuBxW0n1 3W0Q8yXdo7KQ2t1Hn1iY4BV0kIzge8TAA6gl5aERW5fR6hZhj3TpTeQ0eCBSB3kwHbQuwyGDRSSn qB3SMXe0VBH7MW8dep0kvWE0raTc7n5lnySCpEcN6Uk7N2j_NcadyxfQceafhCaF5oWH0hlCG5hp wLptKvI.T_lmJJYTzVK35KB7NjyZRj204NMjxx2xKKvjCCAxh.F_wSEKiqsGcxc1I3vJoCV8MGdV pv61RKz1TsiDl0dKM2ug364fhTi2uMmBo62jaEGtgeXQ5Q4pQqdKb9IGbtm_kM2CWALq9BMiqCzd qsWBFY5Pvri3m7q3BWAuu1tAvRymQIXaHQnxrhAa2v Original-Received: from sonic.gate.mail.ne1.yahoo.com by sonic306.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com with HTTP; Sun, 9 Aug 2020 17:11:38 +0000 Original-Received: by smtp422.mail.bf1.yahoo.com (VZM Hermes SMTP Server) with ESMTPA ID b4384767806cdb6061683c743ad17129; Sun, 09 Aug 2020 17:11:34 +0000 (UTC) Content-Language: en-US X-Mailer: WebService/1.1.16436 mail.backend.jedi.jws.acl:role.jedi.acl.token.atz.jws.hermes.aol Apache-HttpAsyncClient/4.1.4 (Java/11.0.7) Received-SPF: pass client-ip=66.163.189.83; envelope-from=clive.tovero@aol.com; helo=sonic306-21.consmr.mail.ne1.yahoo.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: First seen = 2020/08/09 13:11:38 X-ACL-Warn: Detected OS = Linux 3.11 and newer [fuzzy] X-Spam_score_int: -30 X-Spam_score: -3.1 X-Spam_bar: --- X-Spam_report: (-3.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2=-1, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001 autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:253556 Archived-At: Personally, I side with the approach of Emacs rather than Blender. I've been using Emacs since 1985 on TOPS-20. I'm working on a set of extensions to Emacs do do 3D modeling without the cockpit-like interface of Blender. I use "Emacs" in the general sense, and include MIT-Scheme's Edwin, Dylan's Deuce, CL's Portable Hemlock, or QEmacs by Fabrice Bellard as candidates for my system. Someone did a video editing app on Emacs a number of years ago (looks like it might be abandoned, but waiting): https://gneve-webma-dev.blogspot.com/ My summary from a private message to RMS yesterday (he keeps asking me to volunteer for GNU, and I am trying to do that): > My project is adding extensions to Emacs to provide the functionality that the free software program Blender provides--but without the GUI and using code. Blender is a program to model, animate, edit, and produce CG movies. The models can be used for 3D printing. It is very popular, and nice, but its interface looks like the cockpit of a 747. I get lost among the widgets. OpenSCAD is another similar project, without a GUI--but has its own modeling language. > My software provides 3D model functional graphical modeling, a relatively new technique to express geometry with the potential expressiveness of the lambda calculus. Models in my software are specified in Lisp (most dialects could be used), a very natural language for the domain. Previous work: > https://common-lisp.net/project/tovero/ > https://common-lisp.net/project/clive > I've made quite a bit of progress in the past two years (mostly unpublished). > I have written a demo viewer in Guile running under Emacs with Geiser to show more proof of concept: > https://gitlab.com/kavalogic-inc/inspekt3d > Again, I would like to work with GNU on this, and I'm still open to it, but I just haven't been able connect for some reason.