From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Jim Porter Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Could Emacs Have a Set-up Wizard? 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[76.168.148.233]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id p9sm409409pfq.15.2021.09.03.16.15.18 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Fri, 03 Sep 2021 16:15:19 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <871r65peql.fsf@fastmail.fm> Content-Language: en-US Received-SPF: pass client-ip=2607:f8b0:4864:20::433; envelope-from=jporterbugs@gmail.com; helo=mail-pf1-x433.google.com X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:273825 Archived-At: On 9/3/2021 12:35 PM, Joost Kremers wrote: > I also think it's a good idea, but I don't think it's entirely orthogonal to the > idea of profiles. I don't really see how profiles would make it easier for new > users to start using Emacs. A wizard, on the other hand, seems to me to be much > better suited for that purpose. (If done right, of course.) I agree. While profiles improve upon the current state of affairs in some ways, a wizard would (theoretically) make it easier for a user to set up a starting configuration that makes sense for them. Rather than picking between one of a handful of profiles, the user could mix-and-match as needed. Done well, it could even give users a glimpse into how to hand-edit their .emacs when they're ready to start more-elaborate customization. Furthermore, a wizard could be useful for upgrading Emacs. Whether a new behavior is opt-in or opt-out, there are bound to be some that are so significant that it makes sense to notify the user. However, this would need some careful thought about how to be both 1) non-annoying and 2) maintainable. Making it much harder to add a significant new feature would be a bad move. > In fact, I would even suggest having the wizard run automatically if no init > file is found (with a button to quit the wizard, of course). Also agreed (with the caveat that `emacs -Q' shouldn't start the wizard). In my experience, Emacs does a great job of guiding the moderately-experienced user, but there's an awful lot to get used to a brand-new user. Having something that helps get past the first hurdle of setting up the basics would go a long way, I think. In fact, I bounced off Emacs the first couple times I tried it, and might not have picked it up at all if it hadn't been the only option I had for a time (other than vim, which I had an even harder time getting started with). Surely there are plenty of people out there who bounced off and never returned. - Jim