From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Paul Eggert Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Is it time to drop ChangeLogs? Date: Thu, 7 Jul 2016 16:26:31 +0200 Message-ID: <577E6697.8090603@cs.ucla.edu> References: <56BE7E37.3090708@cs.ucla.edu> <4hd1rw1ubr.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <83vb50wxhv.fsf@gnu.org> <87y49vz4cg.fsf@acer.localhost.com> <87twg2g86g.fsf@lifelogs.com> <83eg76n5h5.fsf@gnu.org> <87y45eeoor.fsf@lifelogs.com> <8337nmn2pd.fsf@gnu.org> <87shvmem2c.fsf@lifelogs.com> <87oa6adz3w.fsf@lifelogs.com> <577E056B.1060705@cs.ucla.edu> <871t35egck.fsf@lifelogs.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1467901627 18553 80.91.229.3 (7 Jul 2016 14:27:07 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 7 Jul 2016 14:27:07 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Jul 07 16:26:59 2016 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1bLAGZ-0007Pm-3d for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 16:26:59 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:40284 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bLAGY-0005E1-5K for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 10:26:58 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:45979) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bLAGL-0005A1-1g for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 10:26:49 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bLAGH-0002BR-1J for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 10:26:45 -0400 Original-Received: from zimbra.cs.ucla.edu ([131.179.128.68]:41305) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bLAGG-0002BK-Rj for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 10:26:40 -0400 Original-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zimbra.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2936E161533 for ; Thu, 7 Jul 2016 07:26:40 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from zimbra.cs.ucla.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (zimbra.cs.ucla.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10032) with ESMTP id IM_xETifUk9s for ; Thu, 7 Jul 2016 07:26:34 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zimbra.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 79331161532 for ; Thu, 7 Jul 2016 07:26:34 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at zimbra.cs.ucla.edu Original-Received: from zimbra.cs.ucla.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (zimbra.cs.ucla.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10026) with ESMTP id tP4g9FItFcqv for ; Thu, 7 Jul 2016 07:26:34 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from [192.168.0.35] (89-159-79-138.rev.numericable.fr [89.159.79.138]) by zimbra.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 11C89161535 for ; Thu, 7 Jul 2016 07:26:33 -0700 (PDT) User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux i686; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.8.0 In-Reply-To: <871t35egck.fsf@lifelogs.com> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x X-Received-From: 131.179.128.68 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:205326 Archived-At: On 07/07/2016 03:18 PM, Ted Zlatanov wrote: > writing ChangeLog-style > commits is definitely not something you'll learn in school or in industry Not true. For example, the following school assignment has students writing ChangeLog-format entries: Change management. UCLA Computer Science 35L,Software Construction Laboratory, Spring 2016, Assignment 4. http://web.cs.ucla.edu/classes/winter16/cs35L/assign/assign4.html More generally, any good undergraduate software-engineering curriculum should cover change management and should have exercises where students describe, review and commit patches, merge branches, etc. There should be some well-defined procedure that students actually do (as opposed to merely reading about it).This stuff is basic nowadays. Of course we can't expect every new Emacs developer to know ChangeLog format, but that'd be true of any format. It's not too much to expect people to look at recent commits and use a similar format (this is standard practice pretty much everywhere). The format from a new user doesn't have to be perfect, after all.