From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Paul Eggert Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Is it time to drop ChangeLogs? Date: Thu, 7 Jul 2016 09:31:55 +0200 Message-ID: <577E056B.1060705@cs.ucla.edu> References: <56BE7E37.3090708@cs.ucla.edu> <4hd1rw1ubr.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <83vb50wxhv.fsf@gnu.org> <87y49vz4cg.fsf@acer.localhost.com> <87twg2g86g.fsf@lifelogs.com> <83eg76n5h5.fsf@gnu.org> <87y45eeoor.fsf@lifelogs.com> <8337nmn2pd.fsf@gnu.org> <87shvmem2c.fsf@lifelogs.com> <87oa6adz3w.fsf@lifelogs.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1467876829 12783 80.91.229.3 (7 Jul 2016 07:33:49 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 7 Jul 2016 07:33:49 +0000 (UTC) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Jul 07 09:33:43 2016 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1bL3oa-0001X7-HA for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 09:33:40 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:37996 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bL3oZ-00027i-Ow for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 03:33:39 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:41601) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bL3n7-0001cu-G5 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 03:32:10 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bL3n4-00052j-9T for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 03:32:09 -0400 Original-Received: from zimbra.cs.ucla.edu ([131.179.128.68]:52945) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1bL3n4-00052B-35 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 07 Jul 2016 03:32:06 -0400 Original-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zimbra.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 45465161515 for ; Thu, 7 Jul 2016 00:32:02 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from zimbra.cs.ucla.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (zimbra.cs.ucla.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10032) with ESMTP id OlysQ_9JIaMU for ; Thu, 7 Jul 2016 00:32:01 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zimbra.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 98DC7161516 for ; Thu, 7 Jul 2016 00:32:01 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at zimbra.cs.ucla.edu Original-Received: from zimbra.cs.ucla.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (zimbra.cs.ucla.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10026) with ESMTP id FAmVkwlGDYMv for ; Thu, 7 Jul 2016 00:32:01 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from [192.168.0.35] (89-159-79-138.rev.numericable.fr [89.159.79.138]) by zimbra.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 2D994161515 for ; Thu, 7 Jul 2016 00:32:01 -0700 (PDT) User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux i686; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.8.0 In-Reply-To: X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x X-Received-From: 131.179.128.68 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:205300 Archived-At: On 07/07/2016 04:44 AM, John Wiegley wrote: >> I disagree with this. Processes such as the one here are learned behavior, >> >not something that identifies good vs. bad programmers. > You are right, of course, Ted Yes and no. Good software engineers are adept at software processes, and this is mainly what distinguishes them from mere good programmers. If we want high-quality software then we need software engineering, not mere programming.