Re: emacs-25 ef33bc7: Spelling and grammar fixes

Re: emacs-25 ef33bc7: Spelling and grammar fixes

[Michael Albinus]

Paul Eggert <eggert@cs.ucla.edu> writes:

Hi Paul,

sorry to come that late, but I have seen the changes just now when
comparing tramp.texi according to the recent changes from today.

> branch: emacs-25
> commit ef33bc7fcf7b2e9fc41706ebce3bfbc814b0e832
> Author: Paul Eggert <eggert@cs.ucla.edu>
> Commit: Paul Eggert <eggert@cs.ucla.edu>
>
>     Spelling and grammar fixes
> ---
>  doc/misc/tramp.texi |   24 ++++++++++++------------
>  etc/ChangeLog.1     |    2 +-
>  2 files changed, 13 insertions(+), 13 deletions(-)
>
> diff --git a/doc/misc/tramp.texi b/doc/misc/tramp.texi
> index b001821..eafd238 100644
> --- a/doc/misc/tramp.texi
> +++ b/doc/misc/tramp.texi
> @@ -883,8 +883,8 @@ This method works only for unified file names, see @ref{Issues}.
>  @cindex smb method
>  
>  This is another non-native @value{tramp} method.  @command{smbclient}
> -connects to any host with SMB/CIFS protocol, such as MS Windows and
> -Samba Servers running on Unixes.  Tests show this @value{tramp} method
> +connects to any server supporting the SMB/CIFS protocol, such as MS Windows and
> +Samba running on GNU/Linux.  Tests show this @value{tramp} method
>  works with MS Windows NT, MS Windows 2000, MS Windows XP, MS Windows
>  Vista, and MS Windows 7.

I disagree. Samba does not necessary run on server machines only, it
runs also on desktop machines. And there's also MS Windows; most
machines equipped with this are not servers :-) "... to any host ..."
seems to be proper wording to me.

Furtheron, Samba does not run only on GNU/Linux. I use it myself on
HP-UX machines, and I connect Tramp to Samba running there. That's why
I've used neutral "Unixes".

Finally, I would like to thank you for all other corrections to the
Tramp manual! As a non-native speaker, I'm grateful for this.

Best regards, Michael.

Re: emacs-25 ef33bc7: Spelling and grammar fixes

[Paul Eggert]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1463 bytes --]

Michael Albinus wrote:
> I disagree. Samba does not necessary run on server machines only, it
> runs also on desktop machines. And there's also MS Windows; most
> machines equipped with this are not servers :-) "... to any host ..."
> seems to be proper wording to me.

In networking a "host" can be a client or a server or something else. For 
smbclient to work, it must connect to an SMB server; not any SMB host will do. 
Admittedly this technical interpretation may not be familiar to non-experts so I 
installed the attached patch to try to clarify things. While I was at it, this 
patch streamlines away some old cruft about MS Windows NT servers, CIFS, and the 
like, as it's 2016 now and not 2006.

> Furtheron, Samba does not run only on GNU/Linux. I use it myself on
> HP-UX machines, and I connect Tramp to Samba running there. That's why
> I've used neutral "Unixes".

The word "Unixes" feels funny, at least to this native English speaker. (It's 
not in my English spelling dictionary, which is how I found the word in the 
first place.) And nowadays "Unix" is not neutral: it is a specific 
implementation of the POSIX API and is in competition with GNU. The attached 
patch tries to dodge the issue entirely, as the main point here is Samba and not 
the operating system it's running on.

> I would like to thank you for all other corrections to the
> Tramp manual!

You're welcome. I wish I had more time to help further. Perhaps some day I will.

[-- Attachment #2: 0001-Improve-wording-for-SMB-support.patch --]
[-- Type: text/x-diff, Size: 2167 bytes --]

From 2bb79a750dfc71d1c10ffc55654755be280fc2b8 Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001
From: Paul Eggert <eggert@cs.ucla.edu>
Date: Sun, 24 Jan 2016 16:09:15 -0800
Subject: [PATCH] Improve wording for SMB support

* doc/misc/tramp.texi (External methods): Improve and modernize
wording for discussion of smbclient.  There is no longer any
need to mention the laundry list of old MS Windows implementations
of SMB and CIFS, nor to mention CIFS.  Also, give a URL for Samba.
---
 doc/misc/tramp.texi | 12 +++++-------
 1 file changed, 5 insertions(+), 7 deletions(-)

diff --git a/doc/misc/tramp.texi b/doc/misc/tramp.texi
index 14cd7fc..7bf2e53 100644
--- a/doc/misc/tramp.texi
+++ b/doc/misc/tramp.texi
@@ -851,11 +851,9 @@ External methods
 @cindex method smb
 @cindex smb method
 
-This is another non-native @value{tramp} method.  @command{smbclient}
-connects to any server supporting the SMB/CIFS protocol, such as MS Windows and
-Samba running on GNU/Linux.  Tests show this @value{tramp} method
-works with MS Windows NT, MS Windows 2000, MS Windows XP, MS Windows
-Vista, and MS Windows 7.
+This non-native @value{tramp} method connects via the Server Message
+Block (SMB) networking protocol to hosts running file servers that are
+typically based on @url{https://www.samba.org/,,Samba} or MS Windows.
 
 Using @command{smbclient} requires a few tweaks when working with
 @value{tramp}:
@@ -863,7 +861,7 @@ External methods
 The first directory in the localname must be a share name on the
 remote host.
 
-Since smb shares end in the @code{$} character, @value{tramp} must use
+Since SMB shares end in the @code{$} character, @value{tramp} must use
 @code{$$} when specifying those shares to avoid environment variable
 substitutions.
 
@@ -907,7 +905,7 @@ External methods
 behavior is unlike other @value{tramp} methods, where local user name
 is substituted.
 
-@option{smb} method is unavailable if @value{emacsname} is run under a
+The @option{smb} method is unavailable if @value{emacsname} is run under a
 local user authentication context in MS Windows.  However such users
 can still access remote files using UNC file names instead of @value{tramp}:
 
-- 
2.5.0

Re: emacs-25 ef33bc7: Spelling and grammar fixes

[Michael Albinus]

Paul Eggert <eggert@cs.ucla.edu> writes:

> While I was at it, this patch streamlines away some old cruft about MS
> Windows NT servers, CIFS, and the like, as it's 2016 now and not 2006.

The major message there was the missing part. I've never tested it
towards MS Windows 8, 8.1 or 10, because I haven't seen such machines
myself.

> The word "Unixes" feels funny, at least to this native English
> speaker. (It's not in my English spelling dictionary, which is how I
> found the word in the first place.)

Wikipedia mentions it, <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unix#Branding>. I
know that's not definitive, of course.

Anyway, I'm happy with your patch. Thanks!

Best regards, Michael.