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From: Dmitry Gutov <dgutov@yandex.ru>
To: Eli Zaretskii <eliz@gnu.org>
Cc: stephen@xemacs.org, dak@gnu.org, emacs-devel@gnu.org,
	monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, rms@gnu.org
Subject: Re: RCS, again: another removed functionality: undo last-checkin
Date: Wed, 30 Sep 2015 14:27:56 +0300	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <560BC73C.4040403@yandex.ru> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <83y4fobegc.fsf@gnu.org>

On 09/30/2015 09:37 AM, Eli Zaretskii wrote:

> I guess it tries to follow the same workflow that existed initially
> for file-based VCSes: if the file you act on is not registered, the
> most (perhaps the only) reasonable thing to do is register it.

Registering it is not my end goal. Committing it is.

> Why are you saying it's weird for modern VCSes?  I envision a
> situation where I create several new files and want to add them to
> version control.  What situation did you have in mind where what
> vc-next-action currently does makes little or no sense?

It's just inefficient: I often have a set of new as well as modified 
files that implement a new feature. Before I can commit them, I have to 
hunt the unregistered files in vc-dir (or at least one of them, to press 
M then) and make them registered. If I already marked some registered 
files (because I forgot about the unregistered one), I have to unmark 
them and start from the beginning.

Unless some backends absolutely can't commit unregistered files, we can 
skip that step. And even then, registering them could be a part of a 
backend's checkin implementation.

>> "For a centralized version control system, if any work file in the VC
>> fileset is out of date, offer to update the fileset."
>
> Are you saying this makes no sense for CVS or SVN?  A dVCS is not
> affected, so why drop this?

In the vc-commit's command implementation, of course. It would make no 
sense there.

> In general, IMO dropping such features has 2 disadvantages: it causes
> bug reports when users who are used to using them upgrade and find
> they lost them; and spawns endless discussions here that lead nowhere,
> because there are 2 different crowds involved whose opinions cannot be
> easily reconciled.

If a maintainer could make a decision like that without others 
second-guessing them, we could stop discussions like the ones you 
mentioned with "just do XX now". Be it using a new VC command, or the 
command-line.

> The only advantage is that it makes the code
> simpler, but IMO this is an ephemeral advantage: the code is not that
> complicated,

It's complicated enough that it's not easy to implement the generic 
"amend" functionality on top of vc-next-action.

> In all the years I'm involved with Emacs development, I think the last
> round of changes in VC (I mean the one 9 months or so ago) was the
> first time I saw features dropped not because they are unused or
> incorrectly implemented, but because those who advocated dropping them
> have no use for the back-ends those features support, and some simply
> dislike those back-ends.

That's a misrepresentation of the arguments given in favor of that 
vc-checkin change.

At the end of the day, we should be able to drop features that don't 
make sense for VC. The user can access them via the command-line. As 
long as those aren't used too often, that's not a big loss.



  reply	other threads:[~2015-09-30 11:27 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 140+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2015-09-20 14:33 RCS, again: another removed functionality: undo last-checkin Uwe Brauer
2015-09-20 14:51 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-20 14:58   ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-20 15:39     ` Uwe Brauer
2015-09-21  3:49       ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2015-09-25  7:53         ` Uwe Brauer
2015-09-20 15:40   ` Uwe Brauer
2015-09-20 16:30 ` Stefan Monnier
2015-09-20 19:59   ` Uwe Brauer
2015-09-20 20:01   ` Uwe Brauer
2015-09-20 23:24   ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-09-21  6:50     ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-21  7:25       ` David Kastrup
2015-09-21  7:56         ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-21  8:13           ` David Kastrup
2015-09-21  8:16             ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-21  8:27               ` David Kastrup
2015-09-21  8:37                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-21  8:58                   ` David Kastrup
2015-09-21  9:42                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-21 10:18                       ` David Kastrup
2015-09-21 10:21                       ` Bastian Beischer
2015-09-22  6:56           ` Richard Stallman
2015-09-22 11:49             ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2015-09-22 22:02               ` Richard Stallman
2015-09-22 22:49                 ` Óscar Fuentes
2015-09-23  6:40                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-23  7:18                     ` David Kastrup
2015-09-23  8:28                     ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2015-09-23  9:54                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-23 22:09                   ` Richard Stallman
2015-09-23  5:36                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-09-23  6:52                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-23 13:26                   ` Stefan Monnier
2015-09-23 13:39                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-23 15:02                       ` Stefan Monnier
2015-09-23 15:13                         ` David Kastrup
2015-09-23 15:31                           ` Andreas Schwab
2015-09-23 14:38                     ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2015-09-23 14:59                     ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-09-23 15:21                       ` Stefan Monnier
2015-09-23 15:27                         ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-09-23 17:33                           ` Stefan Monnier
2015-09-30  2:27                             ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-09-30  4:53                               ` Stefan Monnier
2015-09-30  6:46                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-30  8:37                                   ` Stefan Monnier
2015-09-30  8:52                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-30 11:35                                       ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-09-30 12:39                                         ` Stefan Monnier
2015-10-01  2:22                                           ` Richard Stallman
2015-10-01  2:32                                             ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-10-02  2:27                                               ` Richard Stallman
2015-10-02  6:37                                                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-10-02  7:17                                                   ` Andreas Schwab
2015-10-02  7:38                                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-03  1:37                                                   ` Richard Stallman
2015-10-02  6:56                                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-03  1:37                                                   ` Richard Stallman
2015-09-30 14:00                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-01  2:34                                           ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-10-01  7:06                                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-01 19:43                                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-10-01 19:59                                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-01 20:06                                                   ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-10-01 20:12                                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-01 20:22                                                       ` Dmitry Gutov
     [not found]                                                         ` <83a8s28gun.fsf@gnu.org>
2015-10-01 21:01                                                           ` Alan Mackenzie
2015-10-01 21:04                                                             ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-10-01 21:01                                                           ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-10-02  6:32                                                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-02  6:41                                                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-10-02  7:39                                                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-30 12:38                                       ` Stefan Monnier
2015-10-02  2:27                                         ` Richard Stallman
2015-10-02  2:27                                   ` Richard Stallman
2015-10-02  2:24                                 ` Richard Stallman
2015-10-02  3:34                                   ` Stefan Monnier
2015-10-02  7:11                                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-02 12:54                                       ` Stefan Monnier
2015-10-02 13:42                                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-02 14:32                                           ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-10-02 14:40                                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-02 14:54                                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-10-02 14:59                                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-02 15:44                                                   ` Stefan Monnier
2015-10-02 16:32                                                   ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-09-30  6:37                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-30 11:27                                 ` Dmitry Gutov [this message]
2015-09-30 14:13                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-01  2:47                                     ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-10-01  7:18                                       ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-01 12:54                                         ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-10-01 13:07                                           ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-01 17:36                                             ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-10-01 17:52                                               ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-01 19:29                                                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-10-01 19:54                                                   ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-10-01 20:13                                                     ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-10-01 23:55                                               ` Drew Adams
2015-10-02  0:07                                                 ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-10-02  6:16                                                   ` Drew Adams
2015-10-02  2:27                                             ` Richard Stallman
2015-10-02  4:07                                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-10-02  4:13                                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-09-23 19:03                     ` Uwe Brauer
2015-09-23 22:12                     ` Richard Stallman
2015-09-25  8:29                       ` Uwe Brauer
2015-09-26  1:10                         ` Richard Stallman
2015-09-23 22:10                   ` Richard Stallman
2015-09-25  8:30                     ` Uwe Brauer
2015-09-23  6:37                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-21 13:13         ` Stefan Monnier
2015-09-21 13:59           ` David Kastrup
2015-09-21 18:39           ` Stefan Monnier
2015-09-21 14:02       ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-09-21 16:07         ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-21 16:58           ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-09-21 17:06             ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-21 17:24               ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-09-21 19:17                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-21 19:30                   ` David Kastrup
2015-09-21 19:33                   ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-09-21 19:53                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-22  0:39                       ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2015-09-22  6:18                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-22 13:08                       ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-09-22 13:45                         ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-22 18:59                           ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-09-22 19:05                             ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-23  5:54                               ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-09-23  6:58                                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-23 14:49                                   ` Dmitry Gutov
2015-09-23 22:08                               ` Richard Stallman
2015-09-21 19:18                 ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-22  0:26                   ` Stephen J. Turnbull
2015-09-22  6:16                     ` Eli Zaretskii
2015-09-22 12:32                       ` Stefan Monnier
2015-09-22  6:32                     ` Steinar Bang
2015-09-20 17:09 ` Steinar Bang

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