From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Dmitry Gutov Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [Emacs-diffs] master b533552 2/5: Documentation fixes re quotes Date: Fri, 4 Sep 2015 01:08:49 +0300 Message-ID: <55E8C4F1.7040208@yandex.ru> References: <20150831061236.27796.57762@vcs.savannah.gnu.org> <55E3F3AD.2010602@yandex.ru> <55E3F6B6.20205@cs.ucla.edu> <55E3F88A.50003@yandex.ru> <55E3F9D7.6040601@cs.ucla.edu> <55E64B4B.3030006@cs.ucla.edu> <55E86963.3060609@yandex.ru> <55E886A0.8090907@cs.ucla.edu> <55E89630.2060604@yandex.ru> <55E8C0A2.2010809@cs.ucla.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1441318154 28869 80.91.229.3 (3 Sep 2015 22:09:14 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 3 Sep 2015 22:09:14 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Paul Eggert Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri Sep 04 00:09:09 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1ZXcgu-0007rr-NG for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 04 Sep 2015 00:09:08 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:52226 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZXcgu-0001kC-LK for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 03 Sep 2015 18:09:08 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:36980) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZXcgo-0001jd-01 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 03 Sep 2015 18:09:05 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZXcgk-0006eC-0C for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 03 Sep 2015 18:09:01 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-wi0-x22c.google.com ([2a00:1450:400c:c05::22c]:38732) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZXcgj-0006e8-PB for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 03 Sep 2015 18:08:57 -0400 Original-Received: by wiclk2 with SMTP id lk2so3056097wic.1 for ; Thu, 03 Sep 2015 15:08:57 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=sender:subject:to:references:cc:from:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:in-reply-to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=JauI+9VUs5H5V/QNYX/nvFJBEg3/fOC37Q19mwA3Tz4=; b=ZdPWdZA8ijssYccVzSSlRklfJSpEuIu6rIVJ3SaEpyDFbkNg1MJjcScJdUoceOcy03 ep2GQXjz/Lq0HVxspR7NYC61/KaSq/UgZVrFBxxTZSRsnJKrcS9jkgMsjTDcuOWt27n9 fkohiWnnCwZ0N9TPP3bmgLASaMjQXip+odhI4TBUviEBE7s4aZU9QaSgvp/n7MiVPfAJ CkyeboqReCJw8jLzSrW1p6zwZCY8R5+79D0/MCil902e8QR2BO1Nqxx3EwCxwYQOmBoO xP/cDlVW3bZifJNvrwiipHPNXD5cRKfUKPolZn7InbLx7zjvP+atnh9bA0EGmjHpDRz/ /Pww== X-Received: by 10.180.86.231 with SMTP id s7mr812852wiz.90.1441318136933; Thu, 03 Sep 2015 15:08:56 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from [10.9.0.103] (nat.webazilla.com. [78.140.128.228]) by smtp.googlemail.com with ESMTPSA id ex17sm598873wid.23.2015.09.03.15.08.55 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Thu, 03 Sep 2015 15:08:56 -0700 (PDT) User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:40.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/40.0 In-Reply-To: <55E8C0A2.2010809@cs.ucla.edu> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Error: Malformed IPv6 address (bad octet value). X-Received-From: 2a00:1450:400c:c05::22c X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:189562 Archived-At: On 09/04/2015 12:50 AM, Paul Eggert wrote: >> If the programmer types ‘foo‘, they can easily miss the non-matching >> quotes > > First, the two scenarios are the same in the typical text-quoting-style > case, because the output looks like ‘foo‘ either way, Not if the translation logic checks for pairing. This is not true of the current code (IIUC), but it was true not too long ago, and that's what Stefan's asking for as well. > and whatever > method works for detecting input `foo` will work equally well for > detecting input ‘foo‘. What method are you thinking of? Lint-like highlighting in red is only feasible if the syntax is strict. > Second and more important, it’s more efficient to detect and fix this > issue immediately while typing, as the highlighting around the foo won’t > be as expected and a programmer can see that easily right away and just > backspace and fix the bad quote while it’s fresh. Checking highlighting is good, but it only works when we're quoting simple symbols. Not Lisp expressions, key sequences or anything else like that. Also, please recall that highlighting is performed in Lisp. Since you've opted to do translation in C, font-lock cannot accurately handle the quoting syntax, with escapes and etc. > It’d be considerably > more awkward and error-prone to detect the problem only when it’s > rendered into a *Help* buffer. Checking that the output looks right is a natural urge either way. My main point is, in general, non-translating "markup" invites typos. Emacs is powerful enough to paper over many problems, but maybe one should take a hint earlier and spend effort where it really matters.