From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Paul Eggert Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#16292: 24.3.50; info docs now contain single straight quotes instead of `' Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2013 11:07:02 -0800 Organization: UCLA Computer Science Department Message-ID: <52C1C456.2080004@cs.ucla.edu> References: <20131229220810.GF7972@boo.workgroup> <52C0E734.4090403@cs.ucla.edu> <83sita1cbw.fsf@gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1388430495 24444 80.91.229.3 (30 Dec 2013 19:08:15 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2013 19:08:15 +0000 (UTC) Cc: grfz@gmx.de, 16292@debbugs.gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Dec 30 20:08:21 2013 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1VxiCJ-0000jK-QU for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 30 Dec 2013 20:08:19 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:59513 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VxiCJ-0002l1-Ad for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Mon, 30 Dec 2013 14:08:19 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:56154) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VxiC9-0002ku-F8 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 30 Dec 2013 14:08:16 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VxiC2-0007A5-5p for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 30 Dec 2013 14:08:09 -0500 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.43]:39060) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VxiC2-0007A1-28 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 30 Dec 2013 14:08:02 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1VxiC1-0005Yp-Ll for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Mon, 30 Dec 2013 14:08:01 -0500 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Paul Eggert Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Mon, 30 Dec 2013 19:08:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 16292 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 16292-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B16292.138843043121285 (code B ref 16292); Mon, 30 Dec 2013 19:08:01 +0000 Original-Received: (at 16292) by debbugs.gnu.org; 30 Dec 2013 19:07:11 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:53078 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1VxiBC-0005XE-K3 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 30 Dec 2013 14:07:11 -0500 Original-Received: from smtp.cs.ucla.edu ([131.179.128.62]:41673) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1VxiB9-0005X3-TI for 16292@debbugs.gnu.org; Mon, 30 Dec 2013 14:07:08 -0500 Original-Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by smtp.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 225FE39E80F8; Mon, 30 Dec 2013 11:07:07 -0800 (PST) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at smtp.cs.ucla.edu Original-Received: from smtp.cs.ucla.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (smtp.cs.ucla.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id JNmAe6HkzT7d; Mon, 30 Dec 2013 11:07:06 -0800 (PST) Original-Received: from [192.168.1.9] (pool-108-0-233-62.lsanca.fios.verizon.net [108.0.233.62]) by smtp.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id AA9BD39E8008; Mon, 30 Dec 2013 11:07:06 -0800 (PST) User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.2.0 In-Reply-To: <83sita1cbw.fsf@gnu.org> X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x X-Received-From: 140.186.70.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:82763 Archived-At: Eli Zaretskii wrote: > we cannot possibly distribute documentation that looks like > this in some locales. Yes we can. We've been distributing documentation like that for years. Latin-1 markup (which you're advocating) is not legible in all locales. It's not legible in Shift-JIS, for example. And I don't see how Latin-1 markup can work in a text reader in a UTF-8 locale. > So now we are left with a few files that still specify UTF-8, and > still screw up text-mode Info readers in some locales. It's not just the few files that specify "@documentencoding UTF-8". It's several other files that contain UTF-8 characters, files like dbus.texi. These files are being mishandled now, because of the revert, because makeinfo isn't being told what their encoding is. And the first of these files that I found, namely dbus.texi, is specifically talking about multibyte characters in its example, so converting it to Latin-1 would destroy the point of that example. I sympathize with the goal of producing .info files portable to all locales, but this revert is not solving that problem and it is making matters significantly worse in other areas. The other change you're advocating (converting to Latin-1) would be worse yet. Instead, I suggest undoing the revert, and adding something to postprocess the info files, to produce ASCII-only info files. These could be used in locales that don't grok UTF-8. Doing this will avoid screwing up the documentation in .html and .pdf formats. I'll volunteer to write that.