From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Drew Adams" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#5839: 23.1.94; Remove `Narrow' from mode indicators for Info mode Date: Tue, 6 Apr 2010 10:31:36 -0700 Message-ID: <5137DA1F897C45A8B849C9000789D486@us.oracle.com> References: <43BEC694982346EFA19636681E31339B@us.oracle.com> <83k4sky08x.fsf@gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1270576601 1508 80.91.229.12 (6 Apr 2010 17:56:41 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 6 Apr 2010 17:56:41 +0000 (UTC) Cc: 5839@debbugs.gnu.org To: "'Eli Zaretskii'" Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Apr 06 19:56:39 2010 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NzD0u-0004GZ-1x for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Tue, 06 Apr 2010 19:56:36 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:59007 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NzD0t-0000tY-G2 for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Tue, 06 Apr 2010 13:56:35 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NzD0a-0000m3-HT for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 06 Apr 2010 13:56:16 -0400 Original-Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=45268 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NzD0Z-0000ky-1m for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 06 Apr 2010 13:56:16 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NzD0O-0003zj-Oz for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 06 Apr 2010 13:56:14 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.43]:52323) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NzD0O-0003zb-G2 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 06 Apr 2010 13:56:04 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NzCd7-0003s0-LO; Tue, 06 Apr 2010 13:32:01 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: "Drew Adams" Original-Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-To: owner@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Tue, 06 Apr 2010 17:32:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 5839 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 5839-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B5839.127057511214870 (code B ref 5839); Tue, 06 Apr 2010 17:32:01 +0000 Original-Received: (at 5839) by debbugs.gnu.org; 6 Apr 2010 17:31:52 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NzCcy-0003rn-2X for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 06 Apr 2010 13:31:52 -0400 Original-Received: from acsinet11.oracle.com ([141.146.126.233]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1NzCcw-0003ri-FG for 5839@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 06 Apr 2010 13:31:51 -0400 Original-Received: from acsinet15.oracle.com (acsinet15.oracle.com [141.146.126.227]) by acsinet11.oracle.com (Switch-3.4.2/Switch-3.4.2) with ESMTP id o36HVg6E029262 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 6 Apr 2010 17:31:45 GMT Original-Received: from acsmt353.oracle.com (acsmt353.oracle.com [141.146.40.153]) by acsinet15.oracle.com (Switch-3.4.2/Switch-3.4.1) with ESMTP id o36GAEAP009328; Tue, 6 Apr 2010 17:31:41 GMT Original-Received: from abhmt014.oracle.com by acsmt354.oracle.com with ESMTP id 151060401270575099; Tue, 06 Apr 2010 10:31:39 -0700 Original-Received: from dradamslap1 (/141.144.225.69) by default (Oracle Beehive Gateway v4.0) with ESMTP ; Tue, 06 Apr 2010 10:31:38 -0700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 In-Reply-To: <83k4sky08x.fsf@gnu.org> Thread-Index: AcrVrEJ8iwDCvHjXTniE0z4DjSGG5gAACDag X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 X-Source-IP: acsmt353.oracle.com [141.146.40.153] X-Auth-Type: Internal IP X-CT-RefId: str=0001.0A090204.4BBB6FFD.01B1:SCFMA4539814,ss=1,fgs=0 X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list Resent-Date: Tue, 06 Apr 2010 13:32:01 -0400 X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:36000 Archived-At: > > emacs -Q > > C-h i > > > > `Narrow' appears in the list of mode indicators in the mode > > line, along with `Info'. > > Info was working like that since day one. Yes. But not with an active mode-line button. That was really my point (and I should have expressed that more clearly). > > This doesn't make sense for Info mode, where widening is not > > something to encourage. > > Why not? Emacs supports editing Info files, in case you didn't know. I have known, since day one, in case you didn't know. It is still not something that needs encouraging via a button in the mode line. I agree that it is helpful to have `Narrow' in the mode line, to let users know what they're seeing. What I disagree with is that `Narrow' should be an active button (for Info). Anyone needing to widen the Info buffer will know enough to do that - s?he won't need a button for that. It is the presence of a button that is confusing to non-veterans and encourages them to get themselves into trouble or more confusion. There is a reason that `Info-enable-edit' is nil by default. That same reason supports not having `Narrow' be an active button - at the very least whenever `Info-enable-edit' is nil. > I suggest to close this report, as I don't think this is a bug. It's > a rather veteran feature. And I suggest disabling the `Narrow' button, at least when `Info-enable-edit' is nil. That button is NOT a veteran feature (from day one), and it is not something that veterans need, in any case. Try to imagine that you are a newbie and you click mouse-2 on `Narrow'. In Info that is particularly disconcerting: you are likely to be _very_ confused by what you see. There is no need for this feature (button) - for newbies or veterans. ---- BTW, when Info edit is turned on, mouse-1 on `Info Edit' in the mode line brings up an `Edit' menu. The most important operation is missing from that menu: `Info-cease-edit' (C-c C-c).