From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Drew Adams Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: RE: Change of Lisp syntax for "fancy" quotes in Emacs 27? Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2018 01:13:24 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <50000057-63d4-4cc2-98a3-4d70013fc2bc@default> References: <83y3bc2378.fsf@gnu.org> <73c02cbb-888f-478c-a231-923aa43c093e@default> <49b5540d-4bee-3d2e-e629-2a8d8e75ee18@cs.ucla.edu> NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1538874704 32679 195.159.176.226 (7 Oct 2018 01:11:44 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2018 01:11:44 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org, npostavs@users.sourceforge.net To: Paul Eggert , Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sun Oct 07 03:11:40 2018 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1g8xbe-0008OL-DC for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 07 Oct 2018 03:11:39 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:40796 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1g8xdk-0007CV-NE for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 06 Oct 2018 21:13:48 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:32807) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1g8xde-0007CP-8w for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 06 Oct 2018 21:13:43 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1g8xdd-0005cX-I1 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 06 Oct 2018 21:13:42 -0400 Original-Received: from userp2130.oracle.com ([156.151.31.86]:34892) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1g8xdZ-0005Qw-1X; Sat, 06 Oct 2018 21:13:37 -0400 Original-Received: from pps.filterd (userp2130.oracle.com [127.0.0.1]) by userp2130.oracle.com (8.16.0.22/8.16.0.22) with SMTP id w971C7LZ169912; Sun, 7 Oct 2018 01:13:27 GMT DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=oracle.com; h=mime-version : message-id : date : from : sender : to : cc : subject : references : in-reply-to : content-type : content-transfer-encoding; s=corp-2018-07-02; bh=ZF1ffE9wNKaPJSWx5dHmqCJEdqSKofivUNAOkznU5Gs=; b=CgiB2dCcAEISOUQTHIZwWscJ1f2WvGxGL9XNjPIHAqUtgXnG2T9ag4/jCzrmMcZe/Osb 3gr+dk/ZGqI/crJHKQ3cPklMzCPx8m+wKKbmsZIn72yLz66tdFT3ADW5fjRV70/mNNqK P6pYA+Z42/WkzLEa0OfG3uGem6P2AQNFUKueaP1f8oQKDZFy346+IH544a8gmZcX0rbC oDDnrlPfqFK697M79KDV69INkOyAEGGWJDLfIsxDxquDzaLqVAYthaqQMhC5BFf7b9Az HJXJVEOrCSDiVJUJBFvyqqUGHYBqqJ5ZKNfqFlduPuTbuiaiG6WLHGI3hLXksWgE37C8 Hg== Original-Received: from aserv0022.oracle.com (aserv0022.oracle.com [141.146.126.234]) by userp2130.oracle.com with ESMTP id 2mxmft9twn-1 (version=TLSv1.2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 07 Oct 2018 01:13:26 +0000 Original-Received: from userv0121.oracle.com (userv0121.oracle.com [156.151.31.72]) by aserv0022.oracle.com (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id w971DPW5015551 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=OK); Sun, 7 Oct 2018 01:13:25 GMT Original-Received: from ubhmp0017.oracle.com (ubhmp0017.oracle.com [156.151.24.70]) by userv0121.oracle.com (8.14.4/8.13.8) with ESMTP id w971DPvX016115; Sun, 7 Oct 2018 01:13:25 GMT In-Reply-To: <49b5540d-4bee-3d2e-e629-2a8d8e75ee18@cs.ucla.edu> X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Oracle Beehive Extensions for Outlook 2.0.1.9.1 (1003210) [OL 16.0.4735.0 (x86)] X-Proofpoint-Virus-Version: vendor=nai engine=5900 definitions=9038 signatures=668706 X-Proofpoint-Spam-Details: rule=notspam policy=default score=0 suspectscore=0 malwarescore=0 phishscore=0 bulkscore=0 spamscore=0 mlxscore=0 mlxlogscore=815 adultscore=0 classifier=spam adjust=0 reason=mlx scancount=1 engine=8.0.1-1807170000 definitions=main-1810070011 X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 156.151.31.86 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:230270 Archived-At: > > The right approach is to let Lisp tell you about its syntax... we shoul= d _let > Lisp judge_ >=20 > This seems to be assuming that there is something out there called "Lisp"= that > tells us what to do. That's entirely backwards. Lisp is our servant, not = our > master. Lisp syntax should be whatever the best syntax we can come up wit= h, > to help us and our users do our work, and this should be the way we think= and > write about it. Such characters have symbol syntax in Lisp (Elisp, for instance). That's the Lisp syntax in question. Lisp doesn't require you to escape them in symbols. Hasn't done so before and shouldn't do so now (IMHO). Yes, we have liberty to change Lisp, including Lisp syntax, in any number of ways. That doesn't mean that we should.