Re: Poll about proposed change in DEL (aka Backspace) and Delete

[MBR <mbr@arlsoft.com>]

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Hi Richard.

On 9/29/2011 11:42 PM, Richard Stallman wrote:
> In Emacs 24, now in pretest, a change is being considered for ASCII
> DEL (on most keyboards, the Backspace key) and the Delete function
> key.  The change affects the case of an active region that was not
> dragged with the mouse.  The change is that these commands would
> delete the region, rather than just one character as now.
>
> In the past, this behavior was enabled in some minor modes: CUA mode,
> Delete Selection mode, and PC Selection mode.  In the 24.0.90 pretest,
> this behavior is enabled by default.  Thus, building and using the
> pretest is an easy way to try the change.
>
> Here are the questions we hope you will answer:
>
> * Are you in favor of this change?
No. I would not favor this change.
> * Are you opposed to this change?
Yes.  I would oppose the change.
> * How strongly do you feel about the matter?
Rather strongly.
> We don't want to just "count votes" -- we want to understand
> how this affects users.  So if you care about the issue,
> please tell us how the change affects your editing.
>
> * What are the cases where you find it helps?
There are no cases.
> * What are the cases where you find it hurts?
If I understand the proposal correctly, the idea is to bind the function 
normally bound to C-w to the BACKSPACE key and the Delete key.  Have I 
got that right?

As things currently stand, there are three different kinds of delete 
functionality I use: delete 1 character backward, delete 1 character 
forward, and delete the marked region.  For over 25 years I've been used 
to those functions being invoked by BACKSPACE, C-d, and C-w 
respectively.  Yes, I could retrain myself, just as I had to do years 
ago when IBM put the CTRL key in the wrong place.  But it will 
inevitably be a big pain.

If it weren't core functionality you were proposing changing the 
assignments of, I probably wouldn't care.  But delete functionality is 
some of the most basic functionality of any editor, just as stop 
functionality is some of the most basic functionality of a car.  What do 
you think would happen if some car manufacturer decided to violate the 
established standard that the brake pedal is to the left of the gas 
pedal?  If that were to happen, I'm pretty sure there would suddenly be 
a whole lot more car crashes because people would be confused about 
which pedal does what.  Changing keystroke assignments isn't going to 
cause life-threatening crashes, but it will inevitably cause millions of 
pico-crashes -- not anything that's going to cause serious harm, but 
enough to cause real annoyance.

I remember back during the Apple look-and-feel wars you were 
distributing a flyer arguing that if look-and-feel had been the law of 
the land when the typewriter keyboard was first designed, every 
typewriter company would have had to invent its own incompatible layout, 
and instead of typists we'd have Remington keyboard typists, 
Smith-Corona typists, Olivetti typists, etc.  Keystroke letter 
assignments on a typewriter and keystroke function assignments for 
critical functionality in an editor should change seldom or never.

> * What is your level of Emacs experience?
After about 10 years of using vi, I switched to Emacs around 1990, and 
it's been my preferred editor ever since.  However I'm embarrassed to 
admit that I've never gotten around to teaching myself Emacs Lisp.  It's 
truly amazing how much you can get done with Emacs even without 
programming it!
> A further change in the same area has been suggested: when there is an
> active region, a self-inserting character would delete the region
> before the character is inserted by default.
>
> * What would you think of this further change?
It sounds like the goal here is to make Emacs behave like MS Word.  
Why?  If I wanted to use Word, I'd run Word or Libre Office.
> Please send your responses to emacs-delete-poll@gnu.org.
>
>
I do appreciate that you're asking your users' opinions.  I hope you 
decide the right way, i.e. my way :-). (That's a joke, I say, that's a 
joke, son! -- Foghorn Leghorn)

    Mark Rosenthal
    mbr@arlsoft.com <mailto:mbr@arlsoft.com>



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