From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: David De La Harpe Golden Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#8492: 23.3; Time to use a different binding for completion? Date: Wed, 20 Apr 2011 17:41:41 +0100 Message-ID: <4DAF0CC5.5060005@harpegolden.net> References: <87zknuhxl4.fsf@sc3d.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1303319258 24835 80.91.229.12 (20 Apr 2011 17:07:38 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 20 Apr 2011 17:07:38 +0000 (UTC) Cc: 8492@debbugs.gnu.org, Reuben Thomas To: Stefan Monnier Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Apr 20 19:07:33 2011 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([140.186.70.17]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1QCasH-0002XA-GX for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 19:07:33 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:50068 helo=lists2.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1QCasG-00060U-7k for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 13:07:32 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.92]:60110) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1QCasC-00060E-Vv for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 13:07:29 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1QCasB-0005UJ-Og for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 13:07:28 -0400 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.43]:49802) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1QCasB-0005UF-LB for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 13:07:27 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1QCaTa-0006XE-HD; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 12:42:02 -0400 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: David De La Harpe Golden Original-Sender: debbugs-submit-bounces@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-To: owner@debbugs.gnu.org Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Wed, 20 Apr 2011 16:42:02 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 8492 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 8492-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B8492.130331771625105 (code B ref 8492); Wed, 20 Apr 2011 16:42:02 +0000 Original-Received: (at 8492) by debbugs.gnu.org; 20 Apr 2011 16:41:56 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1QCaTT-0006Wr-54 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 12:41:55 -0400 Original-Received: from harpegolden.net ([65.99.215.13]) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1QCaTQ-0006We-Hh for 8492@debbugs.gnu.org; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 12:41:53 -0400 Original-Received: from [87.198.55.90] (87-198-55-90.ptr.magnet.ie [87.198.55.90]) (using TLSv1 with cipher AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (Client CN "David De La Harpe Golden", Issuer "David De La Harpe Golden Personal CA rev 3" (verified OK)) by harpegolden.net (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id EE347683A6; Wed, 20 Apr 2011 17:41:42 +0100 (IST) User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux x86_64; en-US; rv:1.9.2.15) Gecko/20110402 Icedove/3.1.9 In-Reply-To: X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.11 Precedence: list Resent-Date: Wed, 20 Apr 2011 12:42:02 -0400 X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) X-Received-From: 140.186.70.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:45889 Archived-At: On 20/04/11 15:16, Stefan Monnier wrote: >>> Since this problem has been around for a long time and no good key ha= s >>> popped up during this time, I believe that using TAB is the >>> way forward, which means we need to figure out ways to make it work i= n >>> the cases where it currently doesn't. >> I am inclined to agree that that is the path of least resistance; I >> think it remains to be demonstrated that two lots of magic can be >> loaded on to the same key, but I'm prepared to give it a go! > > Of course, pursuing this route doesn't preclude pursuing other routes a= t > the same time. So, people should feel free to suggest other keys to us= e > for completion. > Well, given that the usual mapping on x.org X11 is, for better or worse, Alt key =3D> Meta Windows/other-symbol* key =3D> super then perhaps additionally binding s-TAB out-of-box might be worth=20 considering? I expect it's mostly people with keyboards with such keys=20 who have trouble with M-TAB (and also apparently don't like C-M-i and=20 ESC TAB). (Though you might get people then trying to use such a default binding=20 as precedent to put all sorts of stuff on s-blah, sigh...) Uh, but then given w32 emacs apparently sees "lwindow"/"rwindow" instead=20 of "super" when you press the windows keys (testing in wine not real=20 windows), w32 emacs may also need to be adjusted to map them to=20 left/right super by default and treat them as modifiers. Note that such=20 a mapping would be consistent with typical x11 as above, but also=20 arguably with macosx, where "command" (=E2=8C=98) is often taken to send = super**=20 - and when you plug a pc keyboard into a mac, the windows keys become=20 "command" by default. Yes, macosx, gnustep and x11 all allow fairly=20 easy adjustment, I'm just talking about out-of-box defaults. (Of course, I also don't know if windows itself is now using=20 WindowsKey-TAB for anything, I know it used not to.) I'm one of the people who puts any window manager bindings on super in=20 the first place (windows key, innit...), obviously easy to do in common=20 X11 window managers, so don't need any of this personally (in fact I put=20 what windows has on Alt-Tab on Super-Tab so I wouldn't even see it),=20 it's just a suggestion. * You can get keyboards with a penguin there. :-) ** note how emacs/lisp/term/ns-win-el has a bunch of super bindings=20 out-of-box, saying "Here are some Nextstep-like bindings for command key=20 sequences."...