From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Christian Ohler Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: testing framework and package.el Date: Wed, 13 Oct 2010 21:00:37 +1100 Message-ID: <4CB58345.2060002@fastmail.net> References: <87tyladfnf.fsf@gmx.de> <4CA5DBA2.4050102@fastmail.net> <87tyl5i737.fsf@gmx.de> <4CA86026.1020000@fastmail.net> <87vd5jvw1q.fsf@gmx.de> <4CA9F483.8020000@fastmail.net> <87lj6dewf7.fsf@stupidchicken.com> <4CAA7CA2.5050302@fastmail.net> <87zkut8d7y.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <4CB2D84E.5010405@fastmail.net> <87d3rg6rl9.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <4CB46E7F.6010104@fastmail.net> <871v7v70oa.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1286972193 28954 80.91.229.12 (13 Oct 2010 12:16:33 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 13 Oct 2010 12:16:33 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Chong Yidong , emacs-devel Mailinglist , Sebastian Rose , Stefan Monnier To: "Stephen J. Turnbull" Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Oct 13 14:16:31 2010 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1P60Fj-0004ca-0Z for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 13 Oct 2010 14:16:31 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:52758 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1P609n-0000vD-2E for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 13 Oct 2010 08:10:07 -0400 Original-Received: from [140.186.70.92] (port=34521 helo=eggs.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1P5zwl-0006bb-PW for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 13 Oct 2010 07:56:44 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1P5y8Z-00067E-3Q for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 13 Oct 2010 06:00:44 -0400 Original-Received: from out1.smtp.messagingengine.com ([66.111.4.25]:50811) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1P5y8Z-00067A-0i for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 13 Oct 2010 06:00:43 -0400 Original-Received: from compute2.internal (compute2.nyi.mail.srv.osa [10.202.2.42]) by gateway1.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id C4E905F2; Wed, 13 Oct 2010 06:00:42 -0400 (EDT) Original-Received: from frontend2.messagingengine.com ([10.202.2.161]) by compute2.internal (MEProxy); Wed, 13 Oct 2010 06:00:42 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha1; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=messagingengine.com; h=message-id:date:from:mime-version:to:cc:subject:references:in-reply-to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; s=smtpout; bh=As61FEo58+Id/bIYqt6jRYc14ZQ=; b=is/mu1SIh7kAGLl2M0jXEDeH5jk9LdVqsd5JiK41fV8CL2eYo61aCVlr5ZKL3qMv1OOAWivOJoqV641ELfSWw1fr3omnqtnN0iIEPpgSMvTqifBzt1W7ChYGD5yRB0Z4WLMGdtx+atvj0njrGtzU3PHPrsyqEwR38RHyhEm00bQ= X-Sasl-enc: UDbTgGpg5Ie6VNdvPvVg+WH9VaLTJrtuWPLrECN2LLp6 1286964041 Original-Received: from ohler-macbookpro.local (unknown [113.197.106.249]) by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 042435E4E06; Wed, 13 Oct 2010 06:00:39 -0400 (EDT) In-Reply-To: <871v7v70oa.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:131662 Archived-At: On 13/10/10 4:58, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote: > Christian Ohler writes: > > > I see, thanks for clarifying. Is it really mainly ELisp language > > features where this applies? > > It applies to everything in the Lispref and User Guide. We don't have > tests for UI features in most cases (although there is a suite of > tests to make sure the keyboard works correctly, but this is a real > PITA to exercise because it cannot really be done automatically, > except to some extent on X). I would think Emacs and most packages > would also lack UI tests. ERT has some UI tests. (Maybe just one, I don't remember.) > > worth the trouble. Still, do you think there's a strict boundary > > between shared tests and implementation-specific tests, or a continuum? > > As I wrote before, in my experience, f?boundp is sufficient in most > cases to check for version- or implementation-specific tests. > > The implementation-specific tests are unusual, and mostly happen when > functionality is partially moved from Lisp to C or vice-versa, > resulting in the creation of an -internal version of some function. > Once again, (fboundp 'foo-internal) will usually catch that. OK, that sounds good. > > I was trying to say that it would be easier to write and maintain > > tests if the tests for X.el were in X-tests.el in the same > > directory > > That may be true, but in practice I don't know any large applications > that are organized that way. Do you? Yes. Chromium is a fairly large code base that seems to have .cc, .h and _unittest.cc files next to each other, see, e.g., http://src.chromium.org/viewvc/chrome/trunk/src/remoting/base/ . I know about other proprietary examples but didn't look any further for open-source ones. Christian.