From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Harald Dunkel Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#4743: fundamental mode not sufficiently fundamental yet Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2009 20:27:06 +0200 Message-ID: <4ADCAF7A.6000600@t-online.de> References: <4AD985C8.3020900@t-online.de> <4ADAF632.5080003@t-online.de> Reply-To: Harald Dunkel , 4743@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1256014057 25838 80.91.229.12 (20 Oct 2009 04:47:37 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 20 Oct 2009 04:47:37 +0000 (UTC) Cc: 4743@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com To: Stefan Monnier Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Oct 20 06:47:28 2009 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1N06d6-0001hO-1m for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Tue, 20 Oct 2009 06:47:28 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:34872 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1N06d5-0000vH-DI for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Tue, 20 Oct 2009 00:47:27 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1N06cz-0000v4-L7 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 20 Oct 2009 00:47:21 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1N06ct-0000tq-CL for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 20 Oct 2009 00:47:19 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=36676 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1N06ct-0000tl-71 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 20 Oct 2009 00:47:15 -0400 Original-Received: from rzlab.ucr.edu ([138.23.92.77]:59492) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1N06cs-0005LA-Kp for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 20 Oct 2009 00:47:14 -0400 Original-Received: from rzlab.ucr.edu (rzlab.ucr.edu [127.0.0.1]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id n9K4lCMF015327; Mon, 19 Oct 2009 21:47:12 -0700 Original-Received: (from debbugs@localhost) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Submit) id n9K4j4UI014815; Mon, 19 Oct 2009 21:45:04 -0700 Resent-Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2009 21:45:04 -0700 X-Loop: owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com Resent-From: Harald Dunkel Resent-To: bug-submit-list@donarmstrong.com Resent-CC: Emacs Bugs 2Resent-Date: Tue, 20 Oct 2009 04:45:04 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com X-Emacs-PR-Message: followup 4743 X-Emacs-PR-Package: emacs X-Emacs-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 4743-submit@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com id=B4743.125601335114007 (code B ref 4743); Tue, 20 Oct 2009 04:45:04 +0000 Original-Received: (at 4743) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 20 Oct 2009 04:35:51 +0000 X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. Original-Received: from mailout07.t-online.de (mailout07.t-online.de [194.25.134.83]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id n9K4Zmct014004 for <4743@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Mon, 19 Oct 2009 21:35:50 -0700 Original-Received: from fwd10.aul.t-online.de by mailout07.t-online.de with smtp id 1MzxKR-0004Gp-00; Mon, 19 Oct 2009 20:51:35 +0200 Original-Received: from [192.168.1.2] (STcQriZvQhJgvw7vR8scJifi5wNxVK45YZUa7dM5Wb+-dYpXYT298UDYjd8Ger4wx9@[87.189.122.46]) by fwd10.t-online.de with esmtp id 1Mzwwl-0emBea0; Mon, 19 Oct 2009 20:27:07 +0200 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux x86_64; en-US; rv:1.9.1.4pre) Gecko/20090923 Lightning/1.0pre Thunderbird/3.0b4 In-Reply-To: X-ID: STcQriZvQhJgvw7vR8scJifi5wNxVK45YZUa7dM5Wb+-dYpXYT298UDYjd8Ger4wx9 X-TOI-MSGID: a0f85295-c719-4629-8e84-1789272893ae X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) Resent-Date: Tue, 20 Oct 2009 00:47:19 -0400 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:32119 Archived-At: On 10/19/09 04:04, Stefan Monnier wrote: >> Actually I just want to enter some text without having to care about >> different modes or redefining some internal functions. > > Looks like maybe you don't want Emacs. > Thats surely not the case. I am using Emacs since the early 90s. Sometimes I just don't want any context sensitive operations. Looking at other lines for indentation is surely something what one would see as a special mode. It is not fundamental. >> then the cursor should move to the next tab stop, which should be >> every 8th column, as usual. > > That's not what the TAB key does usually in Emacs. > I understand, but thats what the tab key in all the other editors does, even in ed and good ol' Wordstar. Only emacs wants to get special treatment. >> All the Emacs clones I tried (mg, zile, jove) work this way. > > It turns out that Emacs's fundamental mode used to behave in this way at > some point in the past. But most like those "micro emacsen" do it this > way simply because they want to keep things simple. > And you disagree with Kiss? >> But maybe I am too blind to see. Is there a more basic mode for Emacs >> than "fundamental"? > > I told you there's paragraph-indent-text-mode which may fit your bill. > Otherwise (setq-default indent-fill-function 'indent-to-left-margin) is > another way to get what you want (by reverting to the older behavior, > which is also probably the one still used in XEmacs). > The paragraph-indent-text-mode seems to be more close to what I need. Setting the (undocumented?) indent-fill-function did not work. Regards Harri