From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Drew Adams" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#3501: 23.0.94; Use Unicode in Info (?) Date: Tue, 9 Jun 2009 10:43:01 -0700 Message-ID: <4A0B2BEF97F8491FA12CBE48BBCE7EC9@us.oracle.com> References: <555BAFF565544912A341B5EE3FEE0A7B@us.oracle.com> <20090609171758.GB11634@muc.de> Reply-To: Drew Adams , 3501@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1244570265 15401 80.91.229.12 (9 Jun 2009 17:57:45 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 9 Jun 2009 17:57:45 +0000 (UTC) To: "'Alan Mackenzie'" , <3501@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com> Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Jun 09 19:57:41 2009 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1ME5Zt-0001EY-0B for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Tue, 09 Jun 2009 19:57:41 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:50944 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1ME5Zr-0005aH-Ma for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Tue, 09 Jun 2009 13:57:39 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1ME5Zf-0005VE-1S for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 09 Jun 2009 13:57:27 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1ME5Za-0005UC-FN for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 09 Jun 2009 13:57:26 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=33692 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1ME5Za-0005Tx-7e for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 09 Jun 2009 13:57:22 -0400 Original-Received: from rzlab.ucr.edu ([138.23.92.77]:52551) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1ME5ZZ-0000jO-Hj for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 09 Jun 2009 13:57:21 -0400 Original-Received: from rzlab.ucr.edu (rzlab.ucr.edu [127.0.0.1]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id n59HvJ99006905; Tue, 9 Jun 2009 10:57:19 -0700 Original-Received: (from debbugs@localhost) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Submit) id n59Ho4W2005684; Tue, 9 Jun 2009 10:50:04 -0700 X-Loop: owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com Resent-From: "Drew Adams" Resent-To: bug-submit-list@donarmstrong.com Resent-CC: Emacs Bugs Resent-Date: Tue, 09 Jun 2009 17:50:04 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: owner@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com X-Emacs-PR-Message: followup 3501 X-Emacs-PR-Package: emacs X-Emacs-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 3501-submit@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com id=B3501.12445693954944 (code B ref 3501); Tue, 09 Jun 2009 17:50:04 +0000 Original-Received: (at 3501) by emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com; 9 Jun 2009 17:43:15 +0000 X-Spam-Bayes: score:0.5 Bayes not run. spammytokens:Tokens not available. hammytokens:Tokens not available. Original-Received: from rgminet12.oracle.com (rcsinet12.oracle.com [148.87.113.124]) by rzlab.ucr.edu (8.14.3/8.14.3/Debian-5) with ESMTP id n59Hh9SP004939 for <3501@emacsbugs.donarmstrong.com>; Tue, 9 Jun 2009 10:43:10 -0700 Original-Received: from rgminet15.oracle.com (rcsinet15.oracle.com [148.87.113.117]) by rgminet12.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id n59Hgmar027852 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK); Tue, 9 Jun 2009 17:42:50 GMT Original-Received: from abhmt001.oracle.com (abhmt001.oracle.com [141.146.116.10]) by rgminet15.oracle.com (Switch-3.3.1/Switch-3.3.1) with ESMTP id n59Hh5Sr008847; Tue, 9 Jun 2009 17:43:06 GMT Original-Received: from dradamslap1 (/141.144.80.206) by default (Oracle Beehive Gateway v4.0) with ESMTP ; Tue, 09 Jun 2009 10:42:59 -0700 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Thread-Index: AcnpJh9Nx+zEFC9zTE60izNE2/71WAAAGmhg In-Reply-To: <20090609171758.GB11634@muc.de> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 X-Source-IP: abhmt001.oracle.com [141.146.116.10] X-Auth-Type: Internal IP X-CT-RefId: str=0001.0A090207.4A2E9F24.01E0:SCFSTAT5015188,ss=1,fgs=0 X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 2) Resent-Date: Tue, 09 Jun 2009 13:57:26 -0400 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:28594 Archived-At: > Please no. I absolutely do not want to "experience" fancy=20 > unicode characters when reading info. It's bad enough > getting them in email and in usenet postings from Xah Lee. ;-) What'll you tell your new Unicode toaster, when your old toaster breaks? = ;-) Better give up on iPhone and other such new-fangled gadgets altogether. > ASCII can be displayed perfectly on any > screen or teletype or even punched card puncher that can=20 > display English at all. Unicode, by contrast, needs a fancy setup, > even if lots of computers already have such a setup. Wow! We should reduce Emacs display to the level of a card punch? = Presumably a hand-crank model - no reason to assume electrical support. Isn't Emacs capable of somehow knowing whether the current display can = show non-ASCII chars? If not, we'll forever remain with horse-and-buggy, I = guess. I'm not against coddling your sturdy old card punch, but not at the = price of giving up the world beyond ASCII for the rest of, well, the world beyond = ASCII (does your punch _really_ speak ASCII, or does it speak EBCDIC or = perhaps Univac field-data chars?). Would you by the same token remove the possibility of Emacs files to use = Unicode chars? Library buff-menu.el uses utf-8 encoding, for example, and = displays a U+2014 (em dash char) if available. It tests like this: ;; Use U+2014 (EM DASH) to underline if possible, ;; else use ASCII (i.e. U+002D, HYPHEN-MINUS). (if (char-displayable-p ?\u2014) ?\u2014 ?-) Presumably something similar (but preferably more general) can be done = to ensure that your card punch can swallow J/orgensen if it can't digest = J=F8rgensen. > Is that bad? J/orgensen is more readable (IMHO) than J=C0=ABrgensen = (or > whatever that letter's two bytes actually are). J=F8rgensen is more readable than J/orgensen, but J/orgensen is fine for = a card punch. ;-)