all messages for Emacs-related lists mirrored at yhetil.org
 help / color / mirror / code / Atom feed
From: Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com>
To: Michael Heerdegen <michael_heerdegen@web.de>
Cc: 25627@debbugs.gnu.org, npostavs@users.sourceforge.net
Subject: bug#25627: 25.1; `help-make-xrefs' loads `cl-extra.el' now
Date: Tue, 7 Feb 2017 08:13:10 -0800 (PST)	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <43f576ea-c0e3-453d-a73e-804e890bef9b@default> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <871svam8ky.fsf@drachen>

> > OK, there are some aliases, such as `case' for `cl-case'.  But I
> > thought that such was the case only for situations where Emacs
> > without cl.el did not have such a function/macro/etc. - such as
> > `case'.
> 
> Doesn't cl.el define more than 170 of such aliases?

Dunno, and I don't really care.  The number is not so important.
What can be problematic is if such an alias _clashes_ with a
different construct of the same name for Emacs without cl.el.

I also said:

> > Aside from such messes (and there are a bunch), I think that
> > cl.el, like cl-lib.el, separates its stuff from non-cl.el
> > stuff in Emacs.  I don't think there are cases of changing
> > semantics.  (But if there are, those should be fixed.)
                     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

But again, this bug report is about cl-extra.el, not cl.el.
The single use of `cl-some' here is gratuitous.  There is
no good reason that I'm aware of why a commonly used help
function should use `cl-some'.  There are a zillion simple
ways to do the same thing that is done by `cl-some' here.

If this is not fixed (and even if it is, alas), the door is
open for any number of such abuses.  The direction that leads
is just inclusion of cl.el (or similar that has the same
effect).

Emacs Dev has not decided to include cl.el by default.
If it does, then OK, it does.  But in that case a different
restructuring and probably some other name-change
rationalization will also be needed.

This bug and its fix are simple - trivial even.  You could
even use `cl-loop', no doubt.  That's a macro, so no problem.
(Of course, fixing it without using anything `cl-*' is also
simple.)

I see no reason why anyone would not want this fixed.
Especially considering that if the flood gates are opened
to all cl*.el constructs then there will be a certain amount
of adjusting to do - both for Emacs Dev (cleanup, factoring,
whatever) and for users.





  reply	other threads:[~2017-02-07 16:13 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 15+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2017-02-05 18:44 bug#25627: 25.1; `help-make-xrefs' loads `cl-extra.el' now Drew Adams
2017-02-05 19:24 ` Drew Adams
2017-02-07  0:58 ` npostavs
2017-02-07  2:21   ` Drew Adams
2017-02-07 13:30     ` Michael Heerdegen
2017-02-07 16:13       ` Drew Adams [this message]
2017-02-07 17:19         ` Michael Heerdegen
2017-02-07 22:29     ` Philipp Stephani
2017-02-07 23:00       ` Drew Adams
2017-02-07 23:08         ` Noam Postavsky
2017-02-08  0:18           ` Drew Adams
2017-02-08  1:56             ` npostavs
2017-02-08  1:59               ` Drew Adams
2017-02-08  4:57                 ` npostavs
2017-02-08  5:40                   ` Drew Adams

Reply instructions:

You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:

* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
  and reply-to-all from there: mbox

  Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style

* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
  switches of git-send-email(1):

  git send-email \
    --in-reply-to=43f576ea-c0e3-453d-a73e-804e890bef9b@default \
    --to=drew.adams@oracle.com \
    --cc=25627@debbugs.gnu.org \
    --cc=michael_heerdegen@web.de \
    --cc=npostavs@users.sourceforge.net \
    /path/to/YOUR_REPLY

  https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html

* If your mail client supports setting the In-Reply-To header
  via mailto: links, try the mailto: link
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line before the message body.
Code repositories for project(s) associated with this external index

	https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs.git
	https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs/org-mode.git

This is an external index of several public inboxes,
see mirroring instructions on how to clone and mirror
all data and code used by this external index.