From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Ken Manheimer" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: cursor doesn't show through transparent images in emacs 22, unlike emacs 21 Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 19:01:53 -0400 Message-ID: <2cd46e7f0608251601oc2f17b3p18cb4ab7afdceae9@mail.gmail.com> References: <2cd46e7f0608181622w23c7d2b0h9b963deeadfd1c06@mail.gmail.com> <2cd46e7f0608191849g521593acm1f9dbc355315ffd6@mail.gmail.com> <2cd46e7f0608200810ge8885f7l7ffc88fd30a8a3eb@mail.gmail.com> <85zmdx2o5n.fsf@lola.goethe.zz> <2cd46e7f0608220645i4c9677d3mf778b3ded10dba07@mail.gmail.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: main.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1156546931 13617 80.91.229.2 (25 Aug 2006 23:02:11 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 25 Aug 2006 23:02:11 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org, "Kim F. Storm" Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Aug 26 01:02:09 2006 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by ciao.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1GGkgi-0004Be-Fb for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 26 Aug 2006 01:02:09 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1GGkgh-00074h-SA for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 19:02:07 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1GGkgW-00073t-0V for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 19:01:56 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1GGkgV-00073J-8n for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 19:01:55 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1GGkgV-00073D-5H for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 19:01:55 -0400 Original-Received: from [66.249.82.232] (helo=wx-out-0506.google.com) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1GGkos-0000lk-0X for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 19:10:34 -0400 Original-Received: by wx-out-0506.google.com with SMTP id i26so1086029wxd for ; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 16:01:53 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:cc:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition:references; b=gyRDlgN6Is7a9LrtI0iMqndPAufE5pDubWwNxwHeKzIYjMxZalAvlUcowDf6MJCmXF9b2tKxlJM2Y8mInHwpVtGJiNm/TroZ8uKykon/ez6jBP04Qct9hCMVvcTDjVm+ndSaAMlR3YAUbU5+2djyUSr9jFc9QLNb1Xx0K4ASvZs= Original-Received: by 10.90.117.11 with SMTP id p11mr81904agc; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 16:01:53 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: by 10.90.105.4 with HTTP; Fri, 25 Aug 2006 16:01:53 -0700 (PDT) Original-To: rms@gnu.org In-Reply-To: Content-Disposition: inline X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:58891 Archived-At: On 8/25/06, Richard Stallman wrote: > > as i think i suggested in a previous message, the solution i would > > prefer would be to have some way to qualify icons so that they get a > > solid cursor in their transparent areas, and the default would be to > > have it inactive. eg, a qualifier for xpm, png, gif, and other > > transparent-capable images, like :solid-cursor: > > > > `:solid-cursor-shows BOOLEAN' > > When true, the cursor will appear solid through the transparent > > regions of the image > > This does not make sense without more context. For instance, what > behavior would a value of nil specify? And what happens in > non-transparent regions of the image? i was using it only to elaborate certain details of my suggestion, not as the real documentation. as such, it was meant specifically for those following the context. non-transparent regions seems like a complicated issue. i expect that in many cases it's neither desirable nor practial to mess with them. some systems xor the colors under mouse icons, for instance, but there's no reason to expect the chosen colors would be particularly harmonious, or the icon to even be recognizable with such treatment. however, there's a bind for icons with no transparency - hopefully the highlighted bounding box cursor is sufficient there. > Meanwhile, something about this wording bothers me: the idea that the > cursor appears "through" part of the image. Is this based on the > assumption that the image is "on top of" the cursor? i could as easily have said that the cursor shows "in" the transparent parts of the image, leaving the opaque parts undisturbed. > If so, I think that assumption is backwards and must be changed. The > cursor is "on top of" the image; if we want to display a cursor on the > image, the image should not be allowed to block it out! i think we're on pretty safe ground doing having the opaque parts o the image block out the cursor. consider text characters - cursors being on the character could simply block them from view, reinforcing the paradigm of being on top of the character. that's a terrible loss of information - generally, the character is allowed to show through. the character might be shown in the inverse tone of the cursor, or some chosen color, or something. (emacs goes with a chosen color, i guess.) the situation with glyphs is not so simple, because they can have many, arbitrary colors. in my particular case, having the cursor show in the transparent region has the outline-structure bullet icons and guide lines acting very like elaborate text characters, except that their intricately colored opaque parts are not changed. it works well. -- ken ken.manheimer@gmail.com http://myriadicity.net