* Re: [Emacs-diffs] /srv/bzr/emacs/trunk r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el (menu-bar-tools-menu): Fix case of EDE entry. [not found] <E1U6vh0-0002fR-HZ@vcs.savannah.gnu.org> @ 2013-02-17 15:05 ` Stefan Monnier 2013-02-17 15:27 ` Xue Fuqiao 2013-02-17 19:09 ` [Emacs-diffs] /srv/bzr/emacs/trunk r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el (menu-bar-tools-menu): " Glenn Morris 0 siblings, 2 replies; 10+ messages in thread From: Stefan Monnier @ 2013-02-17 15:05 UTC (permalink / raw To: Glenn Morris; +Cc: emacs-devel > - '(menu-item "Project support (EDE)" > + '(menu-item "Project Support (EDE)" FWIW, I prefer the "less capitalized" forms. Stefan ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
* Re: [Emacs-diffs] /srv/bzr/emacs/trunk r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el (menu-bar-tools-menu): Fix case of EDE entry. 2013-02-17 15:05 ` [Emacs-diffs] /srv/bzr/emacs/trunk r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el (menu-bar-tools-menu): Fix case of EDE entry Stefan Monnier @ 2013-02-17 15:27 ` Xue Fuqiao 2013-02-17 19:20 ` [Emacs-diffs] /srv/bzr/emacs/trunk r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el(menu-bar-tools-menu): " Drew Adams 2013-02-17 19:09 ` [Emacs-diffs] /srv/bzr/emacs/trunk r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el (menu-bar-tools-menu): " Glenn Morris 1 sibling, 1 reply; 10+ messages in thread From: Xue Fuqiao @ 2013-02-17 15:27 UTC (permalink / raw To: Stefan Monnier; +Cc: emacs-devel On Sun, 17 Feb 2013 10:05:12 -0500 Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> wrote: > > - '(menu-item "Project support (EDE)" > > + '(menu-item "Project Support (EDE)" > FWIW, I prefer the "less capitalized" forms. Maybe it can be written into the "Tips and Conventions" section in elisp manual (if most people approve of it). > Stefan -- Best regards, Xue Fuqiao. http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/XueFuqiao ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
* RE: [Emacs-diffs] /srv/bzr/emacs/trunk r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el(menu-bar-tools-menu): Fix case of EDE entry. 2013-02-17 15:27 ` Xue Fuqiao @ 2013-02-17 19:20 ` Drew Adams 2013-02-17 23:59 ` Xue Fuqiao 0 siblings, 1 reply; 10+ messages in thread From: Drew Adams @ 2013-02-17 19:20 UTC (permalink / raw To: 'Xue Fuqiao', 'Stefan Monnier'; +Cc: emacs-devel > > > - '(menu-item "Project support (EDE)" > > > + '(menu-item "Project Support (EDE)" > > FWIW, I prefer the "less capitalized" forms. > > Maybe it can be written into the "Tips and Conventions" > section in elisp manual (if most people approve of it). 1. The most important things are (a) to be fairly consistent across a given context (e.g. a mode or an application) and (b) to use the same capitalization as found in the application, for any terms that serve more or less like proper nouns there (e.g. the name of a buffer that serves as a menu item in menu `Buffers', or an Imenu menu item). 2. Emacs Dev can decide what it wants, beyond that. The two most common capitalization conventions are (a) title case and (b) sentence case (sometimes called downstyle). Title case generally means capitalizing the important words (plus the first), not all the words (sometimes called start case). 3. Historically, title case has tended to be used more in the US; sentence case in Europe and the UK. Dunno about other areas, and usage no doubt varies across media and contexts. 4. #1b means that, barring some other typographical notation to set off such proper terms, sentence case is advantageous when the proper term is itself capitalized, and title case is advantageous when it is not. IOW, what is odd stands out. 5. "The less capitalized forms" is not very operational as guidance. Presumably what Stefan expresses is a preference for sentence case in menus, as opposed to title case or to capitalizing every word. 6. Personally, I favor title case in menus (but again see #1: be consistent). I do so in part because it is overwhelmingly used in menus (to my knowledge), both within Emacs and beyond, and in part because it leads your eye to terms that more important, facilitating scanning. 7. Emacs generally sets off menu names using `...' in the manual (e.g., "Click on `Set Default Font' in the `Options' menu", "click on the menu item named `Source Code Parsers (Semantic)' in the `Tools' menu"). But sometimes it does not (bugs), and in those cases another advantage to title case is that it can be easier to separate visually from the surrounding text. 8. I agree that whatever convention is decided on, it would be good to mention it in the manual, as a guideline. That helps people know what is generally preferred. Given the fact that Emacs already appears pretty consistent in this regard, I thought that title case had already been chosen as our convention, but whatever the choice is, it would be good to document it, as guidance. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Letter_case ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
* Re: [Emacs-diffs] /srv/bzr/emacs/trunk r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el(menu-bar-tools-menu): Fix case of EDE entry. 2013-02-17 19:20 ` [Emacs-diffs] /srv/bzr/emacs/trunk r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el(menu-bar-tools-menu): " Drew Adams @ 2013-02-17 23:59 ` Xue Fuqiao 2013-02-18 0:39 ` Drew Adams 0 siblings, 1 reply; 10+ messages in thread From: Xue Fuqiao @ 2013-02-17 23:59 UTC (permalink / raw To: Drew Adams; +Cc: 'Stefan Monnier', emacs-devel On Sun, 17 Feb 2013 11:20:45 -0800 "Drew Adams" <drew.adams@oracle.com> wrote: > Emacs generally sets off menu names using `...' in the manual (e.g., "Click > on `Set Default Font' in the `Options' menu", "click on the menu item named > `Source Code Parsers (Semantic)' in the `Tools' menu"). But the menu item for Semantic doesn't have `...', and I don't think that it should have `...'. -- Best regards, Xue Fuqiao. http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/XueFuqiao ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
* RE: [Emacs-diffs] /srv/bzr/emacs/trunk r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el(menu-bar-tools-menu): Fix case of EDE entry. 2013-02-17 23:59 ` Xue Fuqiao @ 2013-02-18 0:39 ` Drew Adams 2013-02-20 22:24 ` Xue Fuqiao 0 siblings, 1 reply; 10+ messages in thread From: Drew Adams @ 2013-02-18 0:39 UTC (permalink / raw To: 'Xue Fuqiao'; +Cc: 'Stefan Monnier', emacs-devel > > Emacs generally sets off menu names using `...' in the > > manual (e.g., "Click on `Set Default Font' in the > > `Options' menu", "click on the menu item named > > `Source Code Parsers (Semantic)' in the `Tools' menu"). > > But the menu item for Semantic doesn't have `...', and I don't think > that it should have `...'. Sorry, I have no idea what you mean. In node `Semantic' of the Emacs manual the text is exactly as I quoted it, at least in my version of Emacs (from 2013-02-15 trunk). What "menu item for Semantic" are you referring to? ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
* Re: [Emacs-diffs] /srv/bzr/emacs/trunk r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el(menu-bar-tools-menu): Fix case of EDE entry. 2013-02-18 0:39 ` Drew Adams @ 2013-02-20 22:24 ` Xue Fuqiao 2013-02-20 23:04 ` Drew Adams 0 siblings, 1 reply; 10+ messages in thread From: Xue Fuqiao @ 2013-02-20 22:24 UTC (permalink / raw To: Drew Adams; +Cc: 'Stefan Monnier', emacs-devel On Sun, 17 Feb 2013 16:39:16 -0800 "Drew Adams" <drew.adams@oracle.com> wrote: > > > Emacs generally sets off menu names using `...' in the > > > manual (e.g., "Click on `Set Default Font' in the > > > `Options' menu", "click on the menu item named > > > `Source Code Parsers (Semantic)' in the `Tools' menu"). > > But the menu item for Semantic doesn't have `...', and I don't think > > that it should have `...'. > Sorry, I have no idea what you mean. In node `Semantic' of the Emacs manual the > text is exactly as I quoted it, at least in my version of Emacs (from 2013-02-15 > trunk). What "menu item for Semantic" are you referring to? I mean the `Set Default Font' has `...', but `Source Code Parsers (Semantic)' doesn't have `...'. -- Best regards, Xue Fuqiao. http://www.emacswiki.org/emacs/XueFuqiao ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
* RE: [Emacs-diffs] /srv/bzr/emacs/trunk r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el(menu-bar-tools-menu): Fix case of EDE entry. 2013-02-20 22:24 ` Xue Fuqiao @ 2013-02-20 23:04 ` Drew Adams 0 siblings, 0 replies; 10+ messages in thread From: Drew Adams @ 2013-02-20 23:04 UTC (permalink / raw To: 'Xue Fuqiao'; +Cc: 'Stefan Monnier', emacs-devel > I mean the `Set Default Font' has `...', but `Source Code > Parsers (Semantic)' doesn't have `...'. I still don't understand the relevance to the topic, sorry. If you are just commenting on what the actual menu items are vs should be, that's irrelevant here, but you might want to file a bug. `...' is appropriate for a menu item if the command invoked requires further user interaction (e.g. input). If not, it is inappropriate. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
* Re: [Emacs-diffs] /srv/bzr/emacs/trunk r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el (menu-bar-tools-menu): Fix case of EDE entry. 2013-02-17 15:05 ` [Emacs-diffs] /srv/bzr/emacs/trunk r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el (menu-bar-tools-menu): Fix case of EDE entry Stefan Monnier 2013-02-17 15:27 ` Xue Fuqiao @ 2013-02-17 19:09 ` Glenn Morris 2013-02-17 19:22 ` [Emacs-diffs] /srv/bzr/emacs/trunk r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el(menu-bar-tools-menu): " Drew Adams 2013-02-18 0:06 ` [Emacs-diffs] r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el (menu-bar-tools-menu): " Stephen Berman 1 sibling, 2 replies; 10+ messages in thread From: Glenn Morris @ 2013-02-17 19:09 UTC (permalink / raw To: Stefan Monnier; +Cc: emacs-devel Stefan Monnier wrote: >> - '(menu-item "Project support (EDE)" >> + '(menu-item "Project Support (EDE)" > > FWIW, I prefer the "less capitalized" forms. Existing Emacs menus seems to have standardized on capitalizing, AFAICS. http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2008-11/msg00679.html I thought this was written down somewhere, but cannot find it at the moment. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
* RE: [Emacs-diffs] /srv/bzr/emacs/trunk r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el(menu-bar-tools-menu): Fix case of EDE entry. 2013-02-17 19:09 ` [Emacs-diffs] /srv/bzr/emacs/trunk r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el (menu-bar-tools-menu): " Glenn Morris @ 2013-02-17 19:22 ` Drew Adams 2013-02-18 0:06 ` [Emacs-diffs] r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el (menu-bar-tools-menu): " Stephen Berman 1 sibling, 0 replies; 10+ messages in thread From: Drew Adams @ 2013-02-17 19:22 UTC (permalink / raw To: 'Glenn Morris', 'Stefan Monnier'; +Cc: emacs-devel > >> - '(menu-item "Project support (EDE)" > >> + '(menu-item "Project Support (EDE)" > > > > FWIW, I prefer the "less capitalized" forms. > > Existing Emacs menus seems to have standardized on > capitalizing, AFAICS. > > http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2008-11/msg00679.html > > I thought this was written down somewhere, but cannot find it at the > moment. That's what I thought too, but thanks for the reference. Whether or not there is a new decision about the convention to use, let's document it, as Fuqiao suggested. ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
* Re: [Emacs-diffs] r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el (menu-bar-tools-menu): Fix case of EDE entry. 2013-02-17 19:09 ` [Emacs-diffs] /srv/bzr/emacs/trunk r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el (menu-bar-tools-menu): " Glenn Morris 2013-02-17 19:22 ` [Emacs-diffs] /srv/bzr/emacs/trunk r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el(menu-bar-tools-menu): " Drew Adams @ 2013-02-18 0:06 ` Stephen Berman 1 sibling, 0 replies; 10+ messages in thread From: Stephen Berman @ 2013-02-18 0:06 UTC (permalink / raw To: Glenn Morris; +Cc: Stefan Monnier, emacs-devel On Sun, 17 Feb 2013 14:09:05 -0500 Glenn Morris <rgm@gnu.org> wrote: > Stefan Monnier wrote: > >>> - '(menu-item "Project support (EDE)" >>> + '(menu-item "Project Support (EDE)" >> >> FWIW, I prefer the "less capitalized" forms. > > Existing Emacs menus seems to have standardized on capitalizing, AFAICS. Most (but not all) Gnus menu items only have the first word capitalized. Steve Berman ^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 10+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2013-02-20 23:04 UTC | newest] Thread overview: 10+ messages (download: mbox.gz follow: Atom feed -- links below jump to the message on this page -- [not found] <E1U6vh0-0002fR-HZ@vcs.savannah.gnu.org> 2013-02-17 15:05 ` [Emacs-diffs] /srv/bzr/emacs/trunk r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el (menu-bar-tools-menu): Fix case of EDE entry Stefan Monnier 2013-02-17 15:27 ` Xue Fuqiao 2013-02-17 19:20 ` [Emacs-diffs] /srv/bzr/emacs/trunk r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el(menu-bar-tools-menu): " Drew Adams 2013-02-17 23:59 ` Xue Fuqiao 2013-02-18 0:39 ` Drew Adams 2013-02-20 22:24 ` Xue Fuqiao 2013-02-20 23:04 ` Drew Adams 2013-02-17 19:09 ` [Emacs-diffs] /srv/bzr/emacs/trunk r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el (menu-bar-tools-menu): " Glenn Morris 2013-02-17 19:22 ` [Emacs-diffs] /srv/bzr/emacs/trunk r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el(menu-bar-tools-menu): " Drew Adams 2013-02-18 0:06 ` [Emacs-diffs] r111816: * lisp/menu-bar.el (menu-bar-tools-menu): " Stephen Berman
Code repositories for project(s) associated with this external index https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs.git https://git.savannah.gnu.org/cgit/emacs/org-mode.git This is an external index of several public inboxes, see mirroring instructions on how to clone and mirror all data and code used by this external index.