From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Drew Adams" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: autoload cookies for defcustoms Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2010 10:31:28 -0800 Message-ID: <2DC911234A9B4A6ABD34459FB8C26C1C@us.oracle.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1264271693 10737 80.91.229.12 (23 Jan 2010 18:34:53 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 23 Jan 2010 18:34:53 +0000 (UTC) To: "'Emacs-Devel devel'" Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Jan 23 19:34:46 2010 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1NYkon-0004j6-HZ for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 23 Jan 2010 19:34:45 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:48823 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NYkoo-0007FK-GS for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 23 Jan 2010 13:34:46 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NYkoi-0007EW-CG for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 23 Jan 2010 13:34:40 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1NYkod-0007CX-TA for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 23 Jan 2010 13:34:40 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=43134 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1NYkod-0007CU-Pn for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 23 Jan 2010 13:34:35 -0500 Original-Received: from rcsinet12.oracle.com ([148.87.113.124]:28753) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1NYkod-0006ec-9H for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 23 Jan 2010 13:34:35 -0500 Original-Received: from rcsinet13.oracle.com (rcsinet13.oracle.com [148.87.113.125]) by rcsinet12.oracle.com (Switch-3.4.2/Switch-3.4.2) with ESMTP id o0NIYUq8001345 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=OK) for ; Sat, 23 Jan 2010 18:34:31 GMT Original-Received: from acsmt355.oracle.com (acsmt355.oracle.com [141.146.40.155]) by rcsinet13.oracle.com (Switch-3.4.2/Switch-3.4.1) with ESMTP id o0NIYTK4026104 for ; Sat, 23 Jan 2010 18:34:29 GMT Original-Received: from abhmt007.oracle.com by acsmt355.oracle.com with ESMTP id 1462498431264271486; Sat, 23 Jan 2010 10:31:26 -0800 Original-Received: from dradamslap1 (/24.5.185.59) by default (Oracle Beehive Gateway v4.0) with ESMTP ; Sat, 23 Jan 2010 10:29:57 -0800 X-Mailer: Microsoft Office Outlook 11 Thread-Index: AcqcWkcXHlo3PHe6RrGN7TzRYmm3gw== X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V6.00.2900.5579 X-Source-IP: acsmt355.oracle.com [141.146.40.155] X-Auth-Type: Internal IP X-CT-RefId: str=0001.0A090206.4B5B4136.00B3:SCFMA4539814,ss=1,fgs=0 X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6 (newer, 3) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:120307 Archived-At: Just curious. Is there a policy, for the Lisp code distributed with Emacs, about using autoload cookies for defcustoms? If so, what is it? Looking through the code, it seems that most defcustoms are not autoloaded, but some are. And in the same library some might be and others not. Some use `purecopy' for their values, so I guess it makes sense to autoload those. But it's not clear which came first, the cookie or the decision to use `purecopy'. If, in some library, only the options that use `purecopy' are autoloaded, doesn't that give a misleading impression to users of `C-h v'? They see only the `purecopy' ones (before loading), which aren't necessarily the most important to know about. IOW, are there two conflicting criteria for autoloading an option: (1) its importance or frequency of use or the need for users to know about it before loading vs (2) the purely technical (implementation) criterion of its use of `purecopy'. Shouldn't the only criterion be use- and user-centered (i.e., #1)? Some options that do not use `purecopy' are nevertheless autoloaded. And some that do use `purecopy' do not have an autoload cookie - e.g., `epa-file-name-regexp', `automount-dir-prefix', `directory-free-space-program', `search-whitespace-regexp', `jka-compr-load-suffixes', `rmail-file-name', `site-run-file', `initial-scratch-message', `vc-directory-exclusion-list', `adaptive-fill-regexp', `adaptive-fill-first-line-regexp'. (Is that wrong, or are all of those libraries always preloaded?) If there is no general policy, and this is decided individually for each defcustom, then just what considerations affect the judgment? And why is there such variability among libraries? The same question could apply to command definitions, but there there doesn't seem to be such a difference among libraries for them. Most commands seem to have autoload cookies (just as most options do not), and I'm guessing that those commands that do not are considered to be less often used.