From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Paul Eggert Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Before l10n, better practices for (message) ? Date: Wed, 24 May 2017 15:09:49 -0700 Organization: UCLA Computer Science Department Message-ID: <26eb65ca-4a37-e707-8090-428fd70ac695@cs.ucla.edu> References: <2623E5C5-4D40-4C9F-BFF6-181D2E69F984@gmail.com> <831srgnuyc.fsf@gnu.org> <6BED2506-B1C2-4005-AFDE-2BF04209F16C@gmail.com> <83zie3mndz.fsf@gnu.org> <83inkrm1ca.fsf@gnu.org> <7C2AD6EB-134C-4013-BE3F-6B302A9DBF8D@gmail.com> <67076bf4-0272-0219-88aa-1f6410fe92de@cs.ucla.edu> <7F5DC149-A21B-4A0F-B1EC-3CC66DD24873@gmail.com> <83y3tmkr1v.fsf@gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1495664018 4368 195.159.176.226 (24 May 2017 22:13:38 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 24 May 2017 22:13:38 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:52.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/52.1.0 Cc: Emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii , Jean-Christophe Helary Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu May 25 00:13:33 2017 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1dDeX7-0000zW-Db for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 25 May 2017 00:13:33 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:57040 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dDeXC-0002V0-IO for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 24 May 2017 18:13:38 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:57713) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dDeTb-0000Q8-TC for Emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 24 May 2017 18:09:56 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dDeTY-0006Vx-PC for Emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 24 May 2017 18:09:55 -0400 Original-Received: from zimbra.cs.ucla.edu ([131.179.128.68]:41524) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dDeTY-0006UX-Io; Wed, 24 May 2017 18:09:52 -0400 Original-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zimbra.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8598E16007F; Wed, 24 May 2017 15:09:50 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from zimbra.cs.ucla.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (zimbra.cs.ucla.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10032) with ESMTP id BM8-lKon-bhH; Wed, 24 May 2017 15:09:49 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by zimbra.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTP id C85231600A1; Wed, 24 May 2017 15:09:49 -0700 (PDT) X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at zimbra.cs.ucla.edu Original-Received: from zimbra.cs.ucla.edu ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (zimbra.cs.ucla.edu [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10026) with ESMTP id 9QNhuv_hV8SV; Wed, 24 May 2017 15:09:49 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from Penguin.CS.UCLA.EDU (Penguin.CS.UCLA.EDU [131.179.64.200]) by zimbra.cs.ucla.edu (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 69B0A16007F; Wed, 24 May 2017 15:09:49 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <83y3tmkr1v.fsf@gnu.org> Content-Language: en-US X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x [fuzzy] X-Received-From: 131.179.128.68 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:215183 Archived-At: On 05/24/2017 12:12 PM, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > He most probably wanted to point out that any infrastructure of > this kind should at least consider using gettext, if not actually use > it. Yes, that was the point. Emacs should be able to internationalize at least as well as gettext does. And basing Emacs i18n on gettext should let us easily share infrastructure with other GNU applications and with the GNU Translation project. There should be no need to reinvent this particular wheel. On 05/24/2017 01:08 AM, Jean-Christophe Helary wrote: > between gettexting emacs and now there are plenty of steps, that include straightening up the strings There is no point to straightening up strings if we don't have a translation infrastructure. In contrast, it would be helpful to have the infrastructure even if some strings still need straightening up, because the other strings will be translated. This suggests that we should focus our initial efforts on getting the infrastructure up, and worry about straightening up strings later. That is why I suggested gettext in response to your question about where we should start.