From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: "Stephen J. Turnbull" Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Emacs rewrite in a maintainable language Date: Tue, 20 Oct 2015 19:17:55 +0900 Message-ID: <22054.5331.907323.998992@turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> References: <561A19AB.5060001@cumego.com> <87lhb1n81y.fsf@gnu.org> <83si594wt3.fsf@gnu.org> <87io64iigs.fsf@gnu.org> <87r3kso1gr.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <87wpuks5ek.fsf@T420.taylan> <83vba4i1z3.fsf@gnu.org> <87pp0cqgjf.fsf@T420.taylan> <83twpoi0sp.fsf@gnu.org> <878u70qf75.fsf@T420.taylan> <83mvvghydi.fsf@gnu.org> <5623E3B5.8050407@dancol.org> <87y4f0kos9.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <5623EAB2.5000008@dancol.org> <87pp0cotqd.fsf@T420.taylan> <5623F7E2.3010200@dancol.org> <87d1wbp9uv.fsf@T420.taylan> <22052.51982.9833.353851@turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <87oafvje34.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <22053.49279.736417.377442@turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> <87si56gfe7.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1445336322 8853 80.91.229.3 (20 Oct 2015 10:18:42 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 20 Oct 2015 10:18:42 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org To: David Kastrup Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Oct 20 12:18:34 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1ZoTzy-0005gh-Iw for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 20 Oct 2015 12:18:30 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:44872 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZoTzx-0001IH-VX for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 20 Oct 2015 06:18:29 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:50588) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZoTzc-0001HP-72 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 20 Oct 2015 06:18:12 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZoTzX-0001uh-Gx for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 20 Oct 2015 06:18:08 -0400 Original-Received: from turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp ([130.158.96.25]:44114) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZoTzT-0001sp-JS; Tue, 20 Oct 2015 06:17:59 -0400 Original-Received: from steve by turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp with local (Exim 4.86) (envelope-from ) id 1ZoTzP-0004S0-UV; Tue, 20 Oct 2015 19:17:56 +0900 In-Reply-To: <87si56gfe7.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> X-Mailer: VM 8.0.12-devo-585 under 21.5 (beta34) "kale" 698a9aa86de4 XEmacs Lucid (x86_64-apple-darwin14.5.0) X-SA-Exim-Connect-IP: X-SA-Exim-Mail-From: steve@turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp X-SA-Exim-Scanned: No (on turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp); SAEximRunCond expanded to false X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.2.x-3.x [generic] X-Received-From: 130.158.96.25 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:192173 Archived-At: David Kastrup writes: > "Stephen J. Turnbull" writes: > > [David pointed this out elsewhere, but I want to emphasize: GUILE > > distributed as a part of Emacs is GPL, not LGPL, and the protection of > > the GPL extends to all code in the Emacs process space. GuileEmacs > > can be distributed only because the LGPL allows promotion to GPL.] > > "process space" is not a legal concept. No, but it is a rule of thumb used by a lot of lawyers, and in the U.S. at least, judges. It comes close for many purposes. > Nobody claims that ld.so is a derivative of all the software it > ends up sharing process space with. I didn't write that /lib/ld-linux.so.2 is a derivative. The object in memory is a derivative (but that doesn't matter for the GPL or LGPL unless you dump the memory to a file). What it does is show that somebody intended to create a derivative of the various files loaded into memory, and that is relevant to judging whether certain files scattered around the Internet should be considered to be a Work covered by the GPL. It's hard to prove that this was the intention *of the author*. The point of the "I-am-GPL" API is precisely that it forces an author to make her intention public. The question is whether Richard will side with the omelette (Emacs's GPL) or with the eggs (the Guile-specific modules that don't call the "I-am-GPL" API). My bet is on the omelette, but we'll see when it actually comes down to that. (Richard is usually firm about not making up his mind until there's actually a problem to be solved.)