From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.blaine.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Marcel Ventosa Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Proposal for an Emacs User Survey Date: Sun, 18 Oct 2020 14:51:33 +0700 Message-ID: <20201018145133.1a25bafb@argon> References: <4a1188f8-9864-54c0-ae6f-5f32102d9757@gmx.com> <20201011073553.GA6784@odonien.localdomain> <20201011120840.GC2923@protected.rcdrun.com> <20201011125031.GC6784@odonien.localdomain> <20201012050418.GZ2923@protected.rcdrun.com> <20201013052736.GE31408@protected.rcdrun.com> <20201016130235.06218dae@argon> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="blaine.gmane.org:116.202.254.214"; logging-data="31941"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" Cc: bugs@gnu.support, thibaut.verron@gmail.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Richard Stallman Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Sun Oct 18 09:53:05 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1kU3V2-0008Cx-VC for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 18 Oct 2020 09:53:04 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:43808 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kU3V2-00068e-1v for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Sun, 18 Oct 2020 03:53:04 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:46780) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kU3U2-0005gY-7j for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 18 Oct 2020 03:52:02 -0400 Original-Received: from aibo.runbox.com ([91.220.196.211]:50670) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_128_GCM_SHA256:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1kU3Tz-0007vp-4X; Sun, 18 Oct 2020 03:52:01 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=runbox.com; s=selector1; h=Content-Transfer-Encoding:Content-Type:MIME-Version: References:In-Reply-To:Message-ID:Subject:Cc:To:From:Date; bh=mdYBqrlYRRPZthqJvl58oM1rcdzzNbHe74n/a7Dc5hs=; b=D6bgrdh4zPez8gozdvIdzYvIU8 oEVF+LFpHqCe+HPHYVEUsEsa4FaJBGlkzVZrnU11eZzNG3aNl8D65aIkbUBEqZxrwU3VfA5baBODo GU73UAfIcxVe5huvBIpDaKmU5VfiXGyZiDEwW0B9J5FaHTF6PDang3x9R4WPIZYuBqYZefVAhZp7m wFMSEkvbaih076iKb7+kcsshqs6fcaUmTJs5UcgzZYl9yCDBrMcmOFuD2kV55KW4S+YOBwuu5P27L jg/kPb9n8gbVeMnT76qQJRDBoVCh0CVEtaX9aADWs6xb30uajMyUsT4fhxacppd7vHKD65ANtu+gs f9B+qVfA==; Original-Received: from [10.9.9.72] (helo=submission01.runbox) by mailtransmit02.runbox with esmtp (Exim 4.86_2) (envelope-from ) id 1kU3Tv-0004Pe-3e; Sun, 18 Oct 2020 09:51:55 +0200 Original-Received: by submission01.runbox with esmtpsa [Authenticated alias (585453)] (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) id 1kU3Th-0000Y2-2p; Sun, 18 Oct 2020 09:51:41 +0200 In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.17.7 (GTK+ 2.24.32; x86_64-pc-linux-gnu) Received-SPF: pass client-ip=91.220.196.211; envelope-from=mve1@runbox.com; helo=aibo.runbox.com X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: First seen = 2020/10/18 03:13:00 X-ACL-Warn: Detected OS = ??? X-Spam_score_int: -24 X-Spam_score: -2.5 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.5 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_ENVFROM_END_DIGIT=0.25, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW=-0.7, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:258007 Archived-At: On Sun, 18 Oct 2020 00:10:02 -0400 Richard Stallman wrote: > [[[ To any NSA and FBI agents reading my email: please consider ]]] > [[[ whether defending the US Constitution against all enemies, ]]] > [[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]] > > > In fact, I would go the extra mile and say Emacs should expressly > > warn users over the dangers of installing proprietary software > > from unofficial repositories > > That could be a good idea. What would be good occasions on which to > warn? > > Perhaps in list-packages when it sees a non-GNU repo, or when it sees > MELPA? Any non-GNU repo that has not made an express commitment to uphold free sofware values? > Perhaps in describe-package and packageinstall, when the package comes > from a non-GNU repo, or specifically from MELPA? > > Any other ideas? How about something similar to Parabola's `your-freedom' package approach? It doesn't necessarily have to prevent installation of nonfree programs like `your-freedom' does, but could present a warning where the user must expressly agree to run the nonfree package the first time it's loaded (something similar to the `load-theme' warning). I'm not sure what the technical difficulties implementing this would be. It would also require an interested party and an ongoing discussion to keep an up to date list of such packages. If it amounts to 2-3 packages as I was told, it might be a very simple task. This would have the added advantage that individual packages that are not distributed through repositories could be added as they are discovered, and that the responsibility for warning users about the dangers of nonfree programs rests with GNU itself. Who would have the final say for individual candidate packages? In the case of Parabola, I know there have been long discussions about whether certain components of certain programs (such as web browser engines) are unfree. I find these discussions to be a feature rather than an inconvenience though. > > (by the way, I always just assumed MELPA was > > somehow official and related to ELPA, because its name is so > > similar to ELPA). > > Yes, this is a source of confusion. > > Perhaps we should renamme GNU ELPA to a name that will avoid this > confusion. Maybe GNU EP (GNU Emacs Packages)? > > EP is not meaningful to those who don't know what it means. But > neither is ELPA. People understand it only if they have been told. > So EP is no worse than ELPA. > > WDYT? This solution would have saved me from the name related confusion.