From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.io!.POSTED.ciao.gmane.io!not-for-mail From: Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: GNU Emacs raison d'etre Date: Thu, 21 May 2020 10:03:49 +0200 Message-ID: <20200521080349.GC26656@tuxteam.de> References: <871rnnvmdx.fsf@red-bean.com> <87pnb7sira.fsf@red-bean.com> <06bcddd4-6991-e4f7-e944-93de14af263d@yandex.ru> <87h7wjsd8o.fsf@red-bean.com> <20897f01-122d-7f91-eac2-70f5ad75796f@yandex.ru> <87d077qfmm.fsf@red-bean.com> <87y2pmw9ld.fsf@red-bean.com> <6e4190a4-765d-6abd-1ae2-8c1432c29d65@yandex.ru> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="eHhjakXzOLJAF9wJ" Injection-Info: ciao.gmane.io; posting-host="ciao.gmane.io:159.69.161.202"; logging-data="66054"; mail-complaints-to="usenet@ciao.gmane.io" User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) To: emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Thu May 21 10:04:24 2020 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([209.51.188.17]) by ciao.gmane.io with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.92) (envelope-from ) id 1jbgBj-000H2v-Nt for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 21 May 2020 10:04:23 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:48982 helo=lists1p.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jbgBi-0000Ts-Q0 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane-mx.org; Thu, 21 May 2020 04:04:22 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:470:142:3::10]:49832) by lists.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:ECDHE_RSA_AES_256_GCM_SHA384:256) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jbgBF-0008VU-IO for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 21 May 2020 04:03:53 -0400 Original-Received: from mail.tuxteam.de ([5.199.139.25]:39529) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.2:DHE_RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:128) (Exim 4.90_1) (envelope-from ) id 1jbgBE-0001Sg-9J for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 21 May 2020 04:03:53 -0400 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=tuxteam.de; s=mail; h=From:In-Reply-To:Content-Type:MIME-Version:References:Message-ID:Subject:To:Date; bh=e5WDYu8zrxmMHOFs9Zx4wFUV8a/y7RWKZOAqLKtOc2o=; b=cwm+mZiF1S/fH19zoNEaA1B1Dmh6v3yk6HfIGrr57QAhwCJmyi9D5l68QzDXpnr1jou7NFR1iDCEDgAl4/9Tu5Hl/Nxxoi7b8EFi9G6sRdRt3L8lIikwszAvb2Na3LExzcnKdMoyKKZFF/PuoovpJ1eUDGxms7XO/n7T15Xf7XIjVThwAmW8RFvb6gJ7jqx5/m3b5lUBXWlSiKZdsM+ehzXXYBwSQ2FhICuTygt5Y5hlzMeIfwtSi1zoHWhp7yki0soPZPvygtUQtXlj8409FbIP+1sfQOgLI4RDzkCG/Sq0yKoU3zApKAqPe4OR0QwJHRPurAIy0psCIPkF8fmVfA==; Original-Received: from tomas by mail.tuxteam.de with local (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1jbgBB-0007iB-Se for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 21 May 2020 10:03:49 +0200 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <6e4190a4-765d-6abd-1ae2-8c1432c29d65@yandex.ru> Received-SPF: pass client-ip=5.199.139.25; envelope-from=tomas@tuxteam.de; helo=mail.tuxteam.de X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: First seen = 2020/05/21 03:43:55 X-ACL-Warn: Detected OS = Linux 3.1-3.10 [fuzzy] X-Spam_score_int: -20 X-Spam_score: -2.1 X-Spam_bar: -- X-Spam_report: (-2.1 / 5.0 requ) BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001 autolearn=_AUTOLEARN X-Spam_action: no action X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.23 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane-mx.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.io gmane.emacs.devel:251155 Archived-At: --eHhjakXzOLJAF9wJ Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On Thu, May 21, 2020 at 01:07:41AM +0300, Dmitry Gutov wrote: > On 21.05.2020 01:00, Karl Fogel wrote: > >>In this we're, again, similar to other professional software. > >Well, I'm not sure exactly what "professional software" means in this co= ntext, but if it means "expects the user to make sustained investment", the= n I agree. >=20 > I don't know, Blender? Which has reportedly made some strides in > usability lately. Other 3D editors and associated programs. I keep seeing Blender mentioned here. One thing which should be considered is that Blender was "born" 1994. At that time, Emacs was around its 19th version and was already 18 -- so allowed to drink (in some jurisdictions, that is). So I'd expect a more complex community to have gathered around Emacs by now. Basically, I think the main "asset" [1] of a software project to be it's community. Software can be written and can be thrown away (and sometimes it's good to throw some software away, or better, to stash it away for softwar archaeologists to have fun fifty years from now). The longer a community lives, the more complex it is to balance out continuity and innovation. In my eyes, Emacs is doing an outstanding job on that. Cheers [1] I always hesitate to describe humans and groups of them as "assets". It's cold, cynical HR talk. So if you have a better shorthand for me, I'll adopt it Right Now. -- tom=C3=A1s --eHhjakXzOLJAF9wJ Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="signature.asc" Content-Description: Digital signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux) iEYEARECAAYFAl7GNeUACgkQBcgs9XrR2kYzZgCeLsz/4mB23jzU/nfdw1e9mPIJ FWYAnjum3xAQaYzOPdBDLsmjbcB8jbDR =+3Gq -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --eHhjakXzOLJAF9wJ--