From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!.POSTED!not-for-mail From: Alan Third Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Better macOS scrolling (was: Smoother macOS touchpad scrolling) Date: Wed, 13 Sep 2017 17:26:31 +0100 Message-ID: <20170913162631.GA31132@breton.holly.idiocy.org> References: <20170908184634.GA20058@breton.holly.idiocy.org> <86y3pox258.fsf@misasa.okayama-u.ac.jp> <20170909081805.GA20275@breton.holly.idiocy.org> <86ingrl56v.fsf@misasa.okayama-u.ac.jp> <20170910083758.GA30315@breton.holly.idiocy.org> <20170911180920.GA92807@breton.holly.idiocy.org> <86poaveciy.fsf@misasa.okayama-u.ac.jp> NNTP-Posting-Host: blaine.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: blaine.gmane.org 1505320475 5796 195.159.176.226 (13 Sep 2017 16:34:35 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@blaine.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 13 Sep 2017 16:34:35 +0000 (UTC) User-Agent: Mutt/1.9.0 (2017-09-02) Cc: Emacs-Devel devel To: Tak Kunihiro Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Wed Sep 13 18:34:29 2017 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by blaine.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.84_2) (envelope-from ) id 1dsAcP-0001NS-QZ for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 13 Sep 2017 18:34:29 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:43536 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dsAcX-0005na-9C for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Wed, 13 Sep 2017 12:34:37 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:57044) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dsAUm-00083k-9i for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 13 Sep 2017 12:26:37 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dsAUl-0000Vp-79 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 13 Sep 2017 12:26:36 -0400 Original-Received: from mail-wr0-x230.google.com ([2a00:1450:400c:c0c::230]:48301) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS1.0:RSA_AES_128_CBC_SHA1:16) (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1dsAUl-0000Uk-0g for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Wed, 13 Sep 2017 12:26:35 -0400 Original-Received: by mail-wr0-x230.google.com with SMTP id 108so1647704wra.5 for ; Wed, 13 Sep 2017 09:26:33 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=googlemail.com; s=20161025; h=sender:date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id:references:mime-version :content-disposition:content-transfer-encoding:in-reply-to :user-agent; bh=1vE/+GS/C0w6+iTwFZ9KUxD7LwShnBSkyNidr5phz0E=; b=Mf2sgZRf47G0YsHiBqb8hCVU36LnfXE4rAKQqX5LZkdWM33N5ebUr7a+BS3d6rOYYH /XE6pzJK3UWju9P5tCqYO3u1O3bUgC8s9eI9gge5YQLomfCjqxyS9xXkhVUxUs8w++Dm I3qy+sMlsK9jLRXhXmk45mAppCQQaQbMBynC32Tc1fBudihX7UMUJgm1lo1zlQlDw3O2 OZeZlLZikOqu5CWih73P/t+ShbgArDXQobgzGXvBvZ+cc+jD1Yhdgnzn16OLV9Aormdy gBBCyBQld4LXeLElxPzb/scP151YKgaWjhr6RAjxRhU4v0/lfyLn/oewFVjBlnpJ1+hk 0+1g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:sender:date:from:to:cc:subject:message-id :references:mime-version:content-disposition :content-transfer-encoding:in-reply-to:user-agent; bh=1vE/+GS/C0w6+iTwFZ9KUxD7LwShnBSkyNidr5phz0E=; b=GNelr5IpYTbi/H6hjUeK0Ehy1pJJZzrH67GXwgOMIqOIlelRFDZJ51cRwF2vbJXvEF cx0EE111zKi1DFXuVwzVF/+LqTwjClKOr2nfnNEgPe+FQYTKoBssYu/PmTnkohEH3F63 JKQ5GTPAEOLBiZP662EqV8zR3BWgcaAPMZQf1CdaVNwDSxhgRsolfpop5OFrbFQutz5K Vy7E18/lpQjsR6QwAzK4yphLBGIES/x+i8chazDk88EAD/qoIGUbRDI0pAaKz9HUlyoB OP9mqCneimlqLezQ8/s4/iwU8usPYCHDst3+iHFE3a5nv9pfn7gyEjgJVSE/DQkFbxXK sxMA== X-Gm-Message-State: AHPjjUjPGNHSkO5I6SznMHal5D82CAEu03RrKlTuEYS6FL0ehx0g74hf NOOwllitiDnBFDPvgqAqwQ== X-Google-Smtp-Source: ADKCNb6UdK55Uid/H355Mcz/x8IzoRlUbGDp6lBQmY4pf6jxBQqK81Ruj9RVLBG+L9XH2mSCiWUyiw== X-Received: by 10.223.171.21 with SMTP id q21mr15694886wrc.125.1505319992573; Wed, 13 Sep 2017 09:26:32 -0700 (PDT) Original-Received: from breton.holly.idiocy.org (ip6-2001-08b0-03f8-8129-2cce-997a-55b7-29ff.holly.idiocy.org. [2001:8b0:3f8:8129:2cce:997a:55b7:29ff]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id x17sm13025633wrg.50.2017.09.13.09.26.31 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 bits=128/128); Wed, 13 Sep 2017 09:26:31 -0700 (PDT) Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <86poaveciy.fsf@misasa.okayama-u.ac.jp> X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 2a00:1450:400c:c0c::230 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.21 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: "Emacs-devel" Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:218199 Archived-At: On Wed, Sep 13, 2017 at 08:13:25AM +0900, Tak Kunihiro wrote: > > Updated patch attached. > > > > If anyone gives the patch a try, please let me know what you think. > > I tried the patch. I compared experiences with or without the patch on > following setup. > > (setq mouse-wheel-scroll-amount '(1 ((shift) . 5) ((control)))) > (setq mouse-wheel-progressive-speed nil) > > The scrolling experience is with more feel of acceleration. I think > this is good. This should match the scrolling behaviour of other macOS applications. > I also compared with or without the patch on following setup. > > (setq mouse-wheel-scroll-amount '(5 ((shift) . 1) ((control)))) > (setq mouse-wheel-progressive-speed t) > > Both are still too fast. Completely useless, imo. > I think your patch handles two issues. One improves response of > touchpad and other changes default values. I think two issues should be > separated out. I could split it into two, but I don’t see the benefit. The patch, including setting defaults, results in behaviour that is similar to other macOS applications. I’ve been over the previous discussions about changing the defaults for mouse-wheel-progressive-speed, and the general opinion seemed to be that we should be trying to make the defaults as close to the operating system’s standard as possible. This patch does that. It only changes them for the NS port running on macOS. If the same needs to be done on X and MS Windows, then that’s fine, and can be done, but it doesn’t change the fact that we need to set defaults to match the standard macOS behaviour. -- Alan Third