Re: Emacs internationalization resources?

Re: Emacs internationalization resources?

[Rusi]

On Sunday, March 6, 2016 at 6:47:50 PM UTC+5:30, tomas wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I'm helping prepare an introductory course on Emacs for a German
> audience. Since not all are equally at ease with the English
> language, I'd like to collect some pointers on German resources
> for Emacs.
> 
> I already discovered (well, I had my nose gently pushed into) the
> German version of the tutorial, bundled with Emacs (which is an
> awesome thing!).
> 
> Is there a German version of the Emacs menus, for example?
> 
> I'm aware that, due to the construction of Emacs, those approaches
> have their limits (where do you stop with i18n? Docstrings?). The
> extreme introspective nature of Emacs (in itself an awesome thing)
> sets the bar quite high. Is there a gradual approach out there?
> Is such a thing even possible?
> 
> Thanks for any pointers and insights.

[Not exactly in line with your question; hopefully not too OT either]
I tried for a while to collect material on making the skimpy input-method
documentation a bit better.

Sadly couldn't find my way and got lost...

On a more positive note have been playing around with agda and find it exhilarating
to at last find a language that is 2016 and not 1980:

First example from http://learnyouanagda.liamoc.net/toc.html


data ℕ : Set where 
  zero : ℕ
  suc  : ℕ → ℕ

The ℕ is of course noticeable but see also the → rather than the clunky
'->' which gets even uglier in a typical proportional font

[agda is naturally typed in emacs]

Re: Emacs internationalization resources?

[tomas]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Fri, Mar 11, 2016 at 09:27:46PM -0800, Rusi wrote:
> On Sunday, March 6, 2016 at 6:47:50 PM UTC+5:30, tomas wrote:
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > Hash: SHA1
> > 
> > Hi,
> > 
> > I'm helping prepare an introductory course on Emacs for a German
> > audience [...]

> [Not exactly in line with your question; hopefully not too OT either]
> I tried for a while to collect material on making the skimpy input-method
> documentation a bit better.
> 
> Sadly couldn't find my way and got lost...
> 
> On a more positive note have been playing around with agda and find it exhilarating
> to at last find a language that is 2016 and not 1980:

[...]

Definitely a side track, but that's why we are here, after all ;-)

Thanks for the interesting pointers.

Back on track, I'm wading through the mailing lists archives. Perhaps
something comes out of it.

The first round of the intro course, btw, was a rush. Very enjoyable.

Thanks for Emacs ♥

regards
- -- tomás
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux)

iEYEARECAAYFAlbj5sQACgkQBcgs9XrR2ka7IgCfQvpiXhUDi4xTD6XALg4nhopZ
IYgAnRt2d3JfSb6k2CssSs0ry2gSUeWN
=CHEl
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Emacs internationalization resources?

[tomas]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Hi,

I'm helping prepare an introductory course on Emacs for a German
audience. Since not all are equally at ease with the English
language, I'd like to collect some pointers on German resources
for Emacs.

I already discovered (well, I had my nose gently pushed into) the
German version of the tutorial, bundled with Emacs (which is an
awesome thing!).

Is there a German version of the Emacs menus, for example?

I'm aware that, due to the construction of Emacs, those approaches
have their limits (where do you stop with i18n? Docstrings?). The
extreme introspective nature of Emacs (in itself an awesome thing)
sets the bar quite high. Is there a gradual approach out there?
Is such a thing even possible?

Thanks for any pointers and insights.

regards
- -- t
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux)

iEYEARECAAYFAlbcJdcACgkQBcgs9XrR2kaHdwCfWe10U87rlpqNYhAYnyyG/sPl
/TEAn0GDj2ZE94PqNV4BpCDGAvWWlusy
=t2zj
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Re: Emacs internationalization resources?

[Eli Zaretskii]

> Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2016 13:43:03 +0100
> From: <tomas@tuxteam.de>
> 
> Is there a German version of the Emacs menus, for example?

No.  Translating the Emacs UI is a project that still waits for its
volunteer(s).

Re: Emacs internationalization resources?

[tomas]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Sun, Mar 06, 2016 at 05:30:55PM +0200, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
> > Date: Sun, 6 Mar 2016 13:43:03 +0100
> > From: <tomas@tuxteam.de>
> > 
> > Is there a German version of the Emacs menus, for example?
> 
> No.  Translating the Emacs UI is a project that still waits for its
> volunteer(s).

Thanks, Eli. Is there any rough consensus as to how tackle this thing,
iow some kind of "map"?

regards
- -- tomás
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux)

iEYEARECAAYFAlbcTiMACgkQBcgs9XrR2kb6hwCfYkR2xIf7yc7++PmGPkT5NYYt
azIAniqy3pheE/9rcZORvnV8OrPCSDap
=le0w
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Re: Emacs internationalization resources?

[Stefan Monnier]

> Thanks, Eli.  Is there any rough consensus as to how tackle this thing,
> iow some kind of "map"?

I don't think so.  The terrain is fairly rough itself, so it's hard to
know beforehand which path will work better.


        Stefan

Re: Emacs internationalization resources?

[tomas]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On Sun, Mar 06, 2016 at 11:15:51AM -0500, Stefan Monnier wrote:
> > Thanks, Eli.  Is there any rough consensus as to how tackle this thing,
> > iow some kind of "map"?
> 
> I don't think so.  The terrain is fairly rough itself, so it's hard to
> know beforehand which path will work better.

OK, thanks.

regards
- -- tomás
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux)

iEYEARECAAYFAlbcT9wACgkQBcgs9XrR2kY7xACbBGgNe18S6HgDubDViiQbskvt
YIIAn2IwClZSrogxa6AGNxfxNxIznhXZ
=K+sI
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

Re: Emacs internationalization resources?

[Eli Zaretskii]

> From: Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca>
> Date: Sun, 06 Mar 2016 11:15:51 -0500
> 
> > Thanks, Eli.  Is there any rough consensus as to how tackle this thing,
> > iow some kind of "map"?
> 
> I don't think so.  The terrain is fairly rough itself, so it's hard to
> know beforehand which path will work better.

Indeed.

This issue was discussed a couple of times on emacs-devel, so you may
wish reading those discussions, to see what ideas were brought up.