From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Alan Mackenzie Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.bugs Subject: bug#20241: 25.0.50; `setq' with only one argument Date: Tue, 24 Nov 2015 21:09:56 +0000 Message-ID: <20151124210956.GC1840@acm.fritz.box> References: <16400d25-dff1-4bfb-b929-814714f9e20f@default> <20151123143112.83911.qmail@mail.muc.de> <62twoc5zdo.fsf@fencepost.gnu.org> <20151123193138.GG2004@acm.fritz.box> <20151124180452.GB1840@acm.fritz.box> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1448399365 4666 80.91.229.3 (24 Nov 2015 21:09:25 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 24 Nov 2015 21:09:25 +0000 (UTC) Cc: 20241@debbugs.gnu.org To: Artur Malabarba Original-X-From: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Nov 24 22:09:13 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1a1Kps-00024n-AU for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Tue, 24 Nov 2015 22:09:12 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:41419 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1a1Kpt-0007ol-Mp for geb-bug-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Tue, 24 Nov 2015 16:09:13 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:46807) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1a1Kpn-0007jn-Jx for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 24 Nov 2015 16:09:08 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1a1Kpi-00064h-DN for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 24 Nov 2015 16:09:07 -0500 Original-Received: from debbugs.gnu.org ([208.118.235.43]:33757) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1a1Kpi-00064b-A7 for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 24 Nov 2015 16:09:02 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-debbugs by debbugs.gnu.org with local (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1a1Kph-000174-Ox for bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Tue, 24 Nov 2015 16:09:01 -0500 X-Loop: help-debbugs@gnu.org Resent-From: Alan Mackenzie Original-Sender: "Debbugs-submit" Resent-CC: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Resent-Date: Tue, 24 Nov 2015 21:09:01 +0000 Resent-Message-ID: Resent-Sender: help-debbugs@gnu.org X-GNU-PR-Message: followup 20241 X-GNU-PR-Package: emacs X-GNU-PR-Keywords: Original-Received: via spool by 20241-submit@debbugs.gnu.org id=B20241.14483992954190 (code B ref 20241); Tue, 24 Nov 2015 21:09:01 +0000 Original-Received: (at 20241) by debbugs.gnu.org; 24 Nov 2015 21:08:15 +0000 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:51695 helo=debbugs.gnu.org) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1a1Kox-00015V-A9 for submit@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 24 Nov 2015 16:08:15 -0500 Original-Received: from mail.muc.de ([193.149.48.3]:11286) by debbugs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.80) (envelope-from ) id 1a1Koc-00014n-8g for 20241@debbugs.gnu.org; Tue, 24 Nov 2015 16:08:13 -0500 Original-Received: (qmail 49891 invoked by uid 3782); 24 Nov 2015 21:07:52 -0000 Original-Received: from acm.muc.de (p5B146A6A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [91.20.106.106]) by colin.muc.de (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Tue, 24 Nov 2015 22:07:51 +0100 Original-Received: (qmail 2604 invoked by uid 1000); 24 Nov 2015 21:09:56 -0000 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.23 (2014-03-12) X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/1.1.12 (Macallan) X-Primary-Address: acm@muc.de X-BeenThere: debbugs-submit@debbugs.gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15 Precedence: list X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 3.x X-Received-From: 208.118.235.43 X-BeenThere: bug-gnu-emacs@gnu.org List-Id: "Bug reports for GNU Emacs, the Swiss army knife of text editors" List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: bug-gnu-emacs-bounces+geb-bug-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.bugs:109197 Archived-At: Hello, Artur. On Tue, Nov 24, 2015 at 07:26:16PM +0000, Artur Malabarba wrote: > On 24 Nov 2015 6:04 pm, "Alan Mackenzie" wrote: > > There were, after all, only five uses of this > > "feature" in the entire Emacs code base. And one of these was in > > .../obsolete. > A few months ago Stefan changed save-excursion to no longer restore the > mark. IIRC (though I may be forgetting), there were zero uses of this in > the codebase, and he even asked about it on the list and nobody said "I use > this". > Still, after the change was applied, some issues came up on a couple of > highly used packages out there, and my guess is that more will come up once > 25 is released. > I'm not speaking against that change. It was a good change because it fixed > more problems than it created. And the same is true here. This change will > be good. > However, if there are 5 uses of it in the core, then it's likely there are > 30 or 100 uses of it in the wild. This change _will_ break things. So it is > my opinion that it should go in the master branch. The feature freeze > exists for a reason. This is a bug fix. One might debate whether or not allowing implicit nils in setq is a bug or not. But the consequence was that our byte compiler was broken. Maybe not badly broken, but broken nonetheless. On finding a bug, I always try to fix not just the bug itself, but the cause of the bug. It seems clear to me that the ultimate cause of the broken byte compiler was the lack of a check on `setq'. > The emacs 25 branch should only get the warning, instead. A warning really > goes a long way, and it doesn't break anything. A warning does indeed go a long way. However, the breakage which will happen out in the field is not serious. A small number of .el files will fail to compile, and will do so with a clear error message. I suspect a larger number of bugs will be revealed than working code broken. I favour leaving the situation as it is. However, it is for John to decide. If he comes round to the view that an error is too strong, I am willing to turn it back into a warning. -- Alan Mackenzie (Nuremberg, Germany).