From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Alan Mackenzie Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [Emacs-diffs] master 9ffb6ce 5/5: Quoting fixes in lisp/international and lisp/leim Date: Tue, 1 Sep 2015 19:00:14 +0000 Message-ID: <20150901190014.GB1997@acm.fritz.box> References: <20150831061236.27796.57762@vcs.savannah.gnu.org> <55E3F434.2060507@yandex.ru> <55E496DC.1030608@cs.ucla.edu> <877foas9jh.fsf@gmail.com> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1441134145 24691 80.91.229.3 (1 Sep 2015 19:02:25 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Tue, 1 Sep 2015 19:02:25 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Paul Eggert , Dmitry Gutov , Oleh Krehel , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Stefan Monnier Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Tue Sep 01 21:02:15 2015 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1ZWqow-0005kA-SL for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 01 Sep 2015 21:02:15 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:57117 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZWqow-000329-GP for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Tue, 01 Sep 2015 15:02:14 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:35297) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZWqm0-0007MT-F1 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 01 Sep 2015 14:59:13 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZWqlw-0000xq-LH for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 01 Sep 2015 14:59:12 -0400 Original-Received: from mail.muc.de ([193.149.48.3]:65039) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1ZWqlw-0000xN-65 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Tue, 01 Sep 2015 14:59:08 -0400 Original-Received: (qmail 87977 invoked by uid 3782); 1 Sep 2015 18:59:07 -0000 Original-Received: from acm.muc.de (p579E99BB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [87.158.153.187]) by colin.muc.de (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Tue, 01 Sep 2015 20:59:06 +0200 Original-Received: (qmail 2341 invoked by uid 1000); 1 Sep 2015 19:00:14 -0000 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.23 (2014-03-12) X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/1.1.12 (Macallan) X-Primary-Address: acm@muc.de X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: FreeBSD 9.x X-Received-From: 193.149.48.3 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:189415 Archived-At: Hello, Stefan. On Tue, Sep 01, 2015 at 11:39:53AM -0400, Stefan Monnier wrote: > > And to restate my opinion on the matter, since I haven't participated in > > this discussion for a few months: Elisp code should be treated as > > markup. Markup should be easy to view and enter: and since Emacs' main > > language is English, the markup should be easy to enter in the most > > common English keyboard layout and be easy to read in the most common > > English locale. > I generally agree. And to restate what I said earlier in more details, > what I'd like to see fixed is: > - `...' quoting is ugly. This should be fixed in "end user display" > mostly, tho I don't mind if it's also fixed in the source code. Just to emphasize that `...' quoting is not at all ugly on my terminal - in fact, it's rather elegant. However, using curly quotes is problematic. I run on a Linux virtual terminal. So, PLEASE can we have adequate configurability, so that the user can decide for herself what's ugly, and whether it needs "fixing". > - The `...' markup (and it is markup) is ambiguous. > So I thought we were going to replace the `...' markup with ‘...’ markup > (which fixes both points at the same time if we assume that we keep > sticking to ASCII quotes for the rest, tho at the cost of using > non-ASCII markup). Yet again, can we please have any such transformations user configurable? [ .... ] > Stefan -- Alan Mackenzie (Nuremberg, Germany).