couple questions about simple todo

couple questions about simple todo

[scrawler]

Hi guys,

Pardon the baby-level questions.

With a file that looks like this:

#+startup: align nologdone showall
#+todo: next doing finished

* All to Do
** [2015-08-11 Tue] [1/1]
*** finished iron the cat

How can I enter the date stamp so that it is neither active nor inactive? I don't want a link to the agenda, and I'd like it to look like a heading.

also, what's the difference between "doing finished" and "doing | finished"
the pipe character doesn't seem to affect anything.

Thanks.
-- 
signature in pain: "ouch!"
:-)

Re: couple questions about simple todo

[Eric S Fraga]

On Tuesday, 11 Aug 2015 at 10:46, scrawler@gmail.com wrote:

[...]

> How can I enter the date stamp so that it is neither active nor
> inactive? I don't want a link to the agenda, and I'd like it to look
> like a heading.

I don't think you can.  But the agenda will, by default, only show
active time stamps.

> also, what's the difference between "doing finished" and "doing | finished"
> the pipe character doesn't seem to affect anything.

From the manual: 

    "The vertical bar separates the TODO keywords (states that _need
     action_) from the DONE states (which need _no further action_)."

-- 
: Eric S Fraga (0xFFFCF67D), Emacs 25.0.50.2, Org release_8.3.1-34-gb911f1

Re: couple questions about simple todo

[scrawler]

On Tue, Aug 11, 2015 at 05:37:59PM +0100, Eric S Fraga wrote:

> From the manual: 
> 
>     "The vertical bar separates the TODO keywords (states that _need
>      action_) from the DONE states (which need _no further action_)."
> 

I'll go ahead and throw the bar in there. The last todo state is still colored as a "done" state, even without it, but it might just be the leuven theme that does that.

thanks.
-- 
signature drinking: "glugluglug"
:-)

Re: couple questions about simple todo

[Nicolas Goaziou]

Hello,

scrawler@gmail.com writes:

> I'll go ahead and throw the bar in there. The last todo state is still
> colored as a "done" state, even without it, but it might just be the
> leuven theme that does that.

No vertical bar is equivalent to a vertical bar just before the last
TODO state.

The vertical bar is useful when you have more than one final state,
e.g., "DONE", "CANCELED", "FAILED"...

Regards,

-- 
Nicolas Goaziou

Re: couple questions about simple todo

[Eric Abrahamsen]

scrawler@gmail.com writes:

> Hi guys,
>
> Pardon the baby-level questions.
>
> With a file that looks like this:
>
> #+startup: align nologdone showall
> #+todo: next doing finished
>
> * All to Do
> ** [2015-08-11 Tue] [1/1]
> *** finished iron the cat
>
> How can I enter the date stamp so that it is neither active nor
> inactive? I don't want a link to the agenda, and I'd like it to look
> like a heading.

My take on what you've shown here is that you've got it a bit backwards.
Apologies if you've tried many things and you settled on this on
purpose, but it looks like you're trying to organize the Org file to
look like the Agenda.

It took me a while to get used to this, too. I think you'll find the Org
tools work better if you forget about what the file itself looks like,
and just look at the Agenda. So your Org file would look like:

* All to Do [1/1]
** finished iron the cat <2015-08-11 Tue>

And the Agenda will show you everything under its proper date heading.

I've got scheduling Org files I hardly ever look at directly: todos go
in with capture, and are examined, resolved and archived via the Agenda.
It can be freeing, once you let the file itself go!

Yours,
Eric

Re: couple questions about simple todo

[scrawler]

On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 10:27:29AM +0800, Eric Abrahamsen wrote:
> 
> My take on what you've shown here is that you've got it a bit backwards.
> Apologies if you've tried many things and you settled on this on
> purpose, but it looks like you're trying to organize the Org file to
> look like the Agenda.
> 
> It took me a while to get used to this, too. I think you'll find the Org
> tools work better if you forget about what the file itself looks like,
> and just look at the Agenda. So your Org file would look like:
> 
> * All to Do [1/1]
> ** finished iron the cat <2015-08-11 Tue>
> 
> And the Agenda will show you everything under its proper date heading.
> 
> I've got scheduling Org files I hardly ever look at directly: todos go
> in with capture, and are examined, resolved and archived via the Agenda.
> It can be freeing, once you let the file itself go!

I think you may be on to something. I use org every day, but I've been using it for longer than I'd like to admit in underpowered and goofy ways. I get inspired by power-user setups, go for it, get swamped by complexity, throw up my hands.

I'm trying something new here by going as dead-simple as I can. I can always add stuff as the need arises.

I need to keep things reeeeeaaaaaallllly easy while still doing things "the org way." I'll try to use an active timestamp and just try to remain calm.

Oh, and while all the property drawers and options lines and everything are really cool and useful, all the junk that can fill up a buffer can sure get ugly and distracting.

So I can avoid looking at all that?

Thanks.
-- 

Re: couple questions about simple todo

[Eric Abrahamsen]

scrawler@gmail.com writes:

> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 10:27:29AM +0800, Eric Abrahamsen wrote:
>> 
>> My take on what you've shown here is that you've got it a bit backwards.
>> Apologies if you've tried many things and you settled on this on
>> purpose, but it looks like you're trying to organize the Org file to
>> look like the Agenda.
>> 
>> It took me a while to get used to this, too. I think you'll find the Org
>> tools work better if you forget about what the file itself looks like,
>> and just look at the Agenda. So your Org file would look like:
>> 
>> * All to Do [1/1]
>> ** finished iron the cat <2015-08-11 Tue>
>> 
>> And the Agenda will show you everything under its proper date heading.
>> 
>> I've got scheduling Org files I hardly ever look at directly: todos go
>> in with capture, and are examined, resolved and archived via the Agenda.
>> It can be freeing, once you let the file itself go!
>
> I think you may be on to something. I use org every day, but I've been
> using it for longer than I'd like to admit in underpowered and goofy
> ways. I get inspired by power-user setups, go for it, get swamped by
> complexity, throw up my hands.
>
> I'm trying something new here by going as dead-simple as I can. I can always add stuff as the need arises.
>
> I need to keep things reeeeeaaaaaallllly easy while still doing things "the org way." I'll try to use an active timestamp and just try to remain calm.
>
> Oh, and while all the property drawers and options lines and everything are really cool and useful, all the junk that can fill up a buffer can sure get ugly and distracting.
>
> So I can avoid looking at all that?

Sure, in principle you don't need that stuff at all! It depends on what
you're using Org for, but if you're really trying to start simple and
build up, then ignore properties etc for now.

Starting off simple probably means just dumping all your TODOs under one
heading. Use timestamps for events (going to the doctor), SCHEDULED for
tasks you plan to do at a certain time ("iron the cat" above should
probably have been a schedule, not a timestamp), and DEADLINE for tasks
that need to be done by a certain time.

An event should have a timestamp, but not a SCHEDULED or DEADLINE. A
task should have one or both of SCHEDULED and DEADLINE (having both
would mean "this has to be done by tomorrow morning, and I'm working on
it this afternoon").

Use two todo keywords: TODO and DONE.

Then just stay in the Agenda. Use "t" to change todo status, and ">",
"C-c C-s" and "C-c C-d" to manipulate the times. Nearly everything you
want to do can be done using Agenda commands -- read that section of the
manual a couple of times, and don't go to the file unless you have to.

Stick with that until you really start to feel the need for more
complexity. That might be more todo keywords, or maybe tag filtering. Or
customizing how things are shown in the Agenda. My guess is you'll be
able to go pretty far with just the above setup.

Good luck,
Eric

Re: couple questions about simple todo

[Peter Salazar]

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This is great! It should be in the tutorial or something. I'm printing it
out to keep.

On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 12:45 AM, Eric Abrahamsen <eric@ericabrahamsen.net>
wrote:

> scrawler@gmail.com writes:
>
> > On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 10:27:29AM +0800, Eric Abrahamsen wrote:
> >>
> >> My take on what you've shown here is that you've got it a bit backwards.
> >> Apologies if you've tried many things and you settled on this on
> >> purpose, but it looks like you're trying to organize the Org file to
> >> look like the Agenda.
> >>
> >> It took me a while to get used to this, too. I think you'll find the Org
> >> tools work better if you forget about what the file itself looks like,
> >> and just look at the Agenda. So your Org file would look like:
> >>
> >> * All to Do [1/1]
> >> ** finished iron the cat <2015-08-11 Tue>
> >>
> >> And the Agenda will show you everything under its proper date heading.
> >>
> >> I've got scheduling Org files I hardly ever look at directly: todos go
> >> in with capture, and are examined, resolved and archived via the Agenda.
> >> It can be freeing, once you let the file itself go!
> >
> > I think you may be on to something. I use org every day, but I've been
> > using it for longer than I'd like to admit in underpowered and goofy
> > ways. I get inspired by power-user setups, go for it, get swamped by
> > complexity, throw up my hands.
> >
> > I'm trying something new here by going as dead-simple as I can. I can
> always add stuff as the need arises.
> >
> > I need to keep things reeeeeaaaaaallllly easy while still doing things
> "the org way." I'll try to use an active timestamp and just try to remain
> calm.
> >
> > Oh, and while all the property drawers and options lines and everything
> are really cool and useful, all the junk that can fill up a buffer can sure
> get ugly and distracting.
> >
> > So I can avoid looking at all that?
>
> Sure, in principle you don't need that stuff at all! It depends on what
> you're using Org for, but if you're really trying to start simple and
> build up, then ignore properties etc for now.
>
> Starting off simple probably means just dumping all your TODOs under one
> heading. Use timestamps for events (going to the doctor), SCHEDULED for
> tasks you plan to do at a certain time ("iron the cat" above should
> probably have been a schedule, not a timestamp), and DEADLINE for tasks
> that need to be done by a certain time.
>
> An event should have a timestamp, but not a SCHEDULED or DEADLINE. A
> task should have one or both of SCHEDULED and DEADLINE (having both
> would mean "this has to be done by tomorrow morning, and I'm working on
> it this afternoon").
>
> Use two todo keywords: TODO and DONE.
>
> Then just stay in the Agenda. Use "t" to change todo status, and ">",
> "C-c C-s" and "C-c C-d" to manipulate the times. Nearly everything you
> want to do can be done using Agenda commands -- read that section of the
> manual a couple of times, and don't go to the file unless you have to.
>
> Stick with that until you really start to feel the need for more
> complexity. That might be more todo keywords, or maybe tag filtering. Or
> customizing how things are shown in the Agenda. My guess is you'll be
> able to go pretty far with just the above setup.
>
> Good luck,
> Eric
>
>
>

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Re: couple questions about simple todo

[scrawler]

On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 12:45:23PM +0800, Eric Abrahamsen wrote:
> scrawler@gmail.com writes:
> 
> > So I can avoid looking at all that?
> 
> Sure, in principle you don't need that stuff at all! It depends on what
> you're using Org for, but if you're really trying to start simple and
> build up, then ignore properties etc for now.

I meant I could have them, if needed, but wouldn't see them while
looking at the agenda.

I'm going to follow your advice except I'll probaby name TODO and DONE
something different, just to be different.

Thanks very much for your help. :-)
--

Re: couple questions about simple todo

[Eric Abrahamsen]

scrawler@gmail.com writes:

> On Wed, Aug 12, 2015 at 12:45:23PM +0800, Eric Abrahamsen wrote:
>> scrawler@gmail.com writes:
>> 
>> > So I can avoid looking at all that?
>> 
>> Sure, in principle you don't need that stuff at all! It depends on what
>> you're using Org for, but if you're really trying to start simple and
>> build up, then ignore properties etc for now.
>
> I meant I could have them, if needed, but wouldn't see them while
> looking at the agenda.

Oh, I see -- sure, the Agenda view does often end up looking cleaner.

> I'm going to follow your advice except I'll probaby name TODO and DONE
> something different, just to be different.

Rebel!

> Thanks very much for your help. :-)

My pleasure.