From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Alan Mackenzie Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: [Emacs-diffs] trunk r116461: Connect electric-indent-mode up with CC Mode. Bug #15478. Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2014 21:12:38 +0000 Message-ID: <20140324211238.GA3825@acm.acm> References: <20140316223509.GD3854@acm.acm> <20140319224231.GB4783@acm.acm> <20140322131350.GA3163@acm.acm> <20140322231012.GB3562@acm.acm> <87wqfkgk02.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1395695794 9305 80.91.229.3 (24 Mar 2014 21:16:34 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 24 Mar 2014 21:16:34 +0000 (UTC) Cc: Stefan , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: "Stephen J. Turnbull" Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Mar 24 22:16:43 2014 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1WSCEb-0001zI-Th for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 24 Mar 2014 22:16:42 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:38395 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1WSCEb-0007O4-CP for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Mon, 24 Mar 2014 17:16:41 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:48212) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1WSCER-0007Na-G5 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 24 Mar 2014 17:16:38 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1WSCEJ-0005t5-VC for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 24 Mar 2014 17:16:31 -0400 Original-Received: from colin.muc.de ([193.149.48.1]:11561 helo=mail.muc.de) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1WSCEJ-0005so-Lj for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Mon, 24 Mar 2014 17:16:23 -0400 Original-Received: (qmail 85988 invoked by uid 3782); 24 Mar 2014 21:16:21 -0000 Original-Received: from acm.muc.de (pD951B82E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de [217.81.184.46]) by colin.muc.de (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Mon, 24 Mar 2014 22:16:20 +0100 Original-Received: (qmail 3895 invoked by uid 1000); 24 Mar 2014 21:12:38 -0000 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <87wqfkgk02.fsf@uwakimon.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/1.1.12 (Macallan) X-Primary-Address: acm@muc.de X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: FreeBSD 8.x X-Received-From: 193.149.48.1 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:170933 Archived-At: Hello, Stephen. On Mon, Mar 24, 2014 at 03:59:09PM +0900, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote: > Stefan writes: > > > In text mode, if the buffer contains > > > ----------------------------------------- > > > foo > > > bar > > > ----------------------------------------- > > > and point is at the start of the second line, and I type RET, it gives > > > ----------------------------------------- > > > foo > > > bar > > > ----------------------------------------- > > > This is clearly wrong. > > I don't see what is "clear" about it being wrong, sorry. > > I see you don't like it (and Richard apparently doesn't like it either), > > but that's a different problem. > It would be nice if you guys would avoid using keystrokes instead of > commands in this discussion. I think it's perfectly reasonable to > swap the usage of CR and LF from `newline' and `newline-and-indent' to > `newline-and-indent' and `newline', respectively. That's the consensus that was reached here last autumn, at least for programming modes. There was surprisingly little objection, not even from me. I think Drew is the only main objector. For other modes, I don't think such a consensus was reached at all. > That may disconcert us oldtimers, but I suspect it's what newcomers to > Emacs will expect.[1] And it's easy enough to "fix" if you don't like > it. But I hope that's not what Alan's talking about, although it's > entirely unclear to me if that's what Stefan's talking about. The entire section was a bug report by RMS, as was made clear in my post before the attribution was removed by an overenthusiasticly cutting reply, as so often happens in this group. I think Richard was partly taking the role of a new user, and was partly bewildered, possibly put out, himself. > That is, if what Alan means by "type RET" is "type a keystroke bound > to `newline'", then my preference accords with his. I don't think that was what Richard (not me) meant - I think he meant literally and spritiually what he wrote. > For my usage that behavior is *clearly* *wrong*, as in text modes when > there's leading whitespace on a line, either *I* put it there, or some > electrically- crapified command that I just disabled the electricity on > did (and it won't happen again, so there's no reason not to fix it by > hand this time). Yes. I don't think this electric behaviour should be present in Text Mode (and similar) either. -- Alan Mackenzie (Nuremberg, Germany).