From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Dale Snell Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.help Subject: Re: Changing the language of gnus menu entries Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 12:15:53 -0700 Organization: Organization? Me? ROFL!! Message-ID: <20130926121553.4272f651@zothique.localnet> References: <87eh8eekza.fsf@web.de> <874n9amatr.fsf@web.de> <87vc1p9ggs.fsf@web.de> <837ge4hpco.fsf@gnu.org> <87li2k92l8.fsf@web.de> <8338oshfy5.fsf@gnu.org> <45370BAD-3E8A-40A9-835B-C269787D29E3@Web.DE> Reply-To: ddsnell@frontier.com NNTP-Posting-Host: plane.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1380222990 7317 80.91.229.3 (26 Sep 2013 19:16:30 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 26 Sep 2013 19:16:30 +0000 (UTC) To: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org Original-X-From: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Sep 26 21:16:32 2013 Return-path: Envelope-to: geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([208.118.235.17]) by plane.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1VPH39-0004SZ-Mo for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Thu, 26 Sep 2013 21:16:31 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:59555 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VPH39-0006Pd-5q for geh-help-gnu-emacs@m.gmane.org; Thu, 26 Sep 2013 15:16:31 -0400 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([2001:4830:134:3::10]:33827) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VPH2o-0006P3-IC for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 26 Sep 2013 15:16:18 -0400 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VPH2h-0001lu-1R for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 26 Sep 2013 15:16:10 -0400 Original-Received: from filter03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net ([66.133.183.233]:57099) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1VPH2g-0001lN-Sn for help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org; Thu, 26 Sep 2013 15:16:02 -0400 Original-Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by filter03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id CC52518A699 for ; Thu, 26 Sep 2013 19:15:58 +0000 (UTC) Original-Received: from relay04.roch.ny.frontiernet.net ([66.133.182.167]) by localhost (filter03.roch.ny.frontiernet.net [66.133.183.233]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id eQHWzAm7Hyn3 for ; Thu, 26 Sep 2013 19:15:55 +0000 (UTC) X-Originating-IP: [50.39.117.237] X-Previous-IP: 50.39.117.237 Original-Received: from zothique.localnet (50-39-117-237.bvtn.or.frontiernet.net [50.39.117.237]) by relay04.roch.ny.frontiernet.net (Postfix) with ESMTPA id F2F7B17CDE for ; Thu, 26 Sep 2013 19:15:52 +0000 (UTC) In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Claws Mail 3.9.0 (GTK+ 2.24.13; x86_64-redhat-linux-gnu) X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: GNU/Linux 2.6.x X-Received-From: 66.133.183.233 X-BeenThere: help-gnu-emacs@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: Users list for the GNU Emacs text editor List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: help-gnu-emacs-bounces+geh-help-gnu-emacs=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.help:93636 Archived-At: On 26 Sep 2013 04:05:27 GMT Joost Kremers wrote: I can't really contribute much to this discussion, since I'm a native speaker of (American) English, and have only a smattering of other languages. However, I do have a couple of observations. > Rather than think, let's do a little experiment. For fun, I tried > translating a bit of Japanese. Taking the third paragraph from > (after the header "Emacs=E3= =81=AE=E6=80=9D > =E6=83=B3") and feeding it to Google Translate produces the following: >=20 > ,---- > | And I should say first, but the "thought of Emacs" to speak here is > | what I personally made =E2=80=8B=E2=80=8Bup on its own. I have never as= far as I know, I > | saw no one from telling "thought of Emacs", including Stallman. It will > | place for such Stallman continues to exercise toward the "spirit of > | freedom" is a great more his goal in particular, and said not to Ganchu > | small problem of such "thought of Emacs". I want to say anyway, is that > | ideological value is significantly lower because no one is sponsored by. > | Please take care only that point. > `---- >=20 > Which is complete gibberish to me. Not a coherent thought in sight. To be honest, that looks like something that was machine translated in both directions. Yikes! I suspect that a native Japanese speaker would understand text translated from English to Japanese better than a native English speaker would understand Japanese translated to English. Japanese is extremely difficult for (human) Western translators to get right because Japanese is so very dependent on context. Much more so than other languages that I have any knowledge of. It's hard for me to see a machine getting it right. No translation program I've encuntered had any sense of context. > I once tried to find the German equivalent for the Arabic term =C2=ABwazi= ir > al-wuzaraa'=C2=BB ('council of ministers') using Google Translate and was > baffled to see it translated as "Schrank" ('cupboard, closet')... I'll > leave it up to the reader to figure out around which corner Google was > thinking there. ;-) I think I've got an answer to this one. A "council of ministers" is also known as a "cabinet". A different kind of cabinet can also be called a "cupboard" or (maybe) a "closet". Again, no sense of context. Hence the odd translation. --Dale -- Vir: "I thought the purpose of filing these reports was to provide accurate intelligence." Londo: "Vir, intelligence has nothing to do with politics." -- "Babylon 5" episode, "Point of No Return"