From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Alan Mackenzie Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: quotation marks [was Re: TUTORIAL.de updated] Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2012 11:12:38 +0000 Message-ID: <20120121111238.GA2747@acm.acm> References: <20248.15413.907023.894588@a1i15.kph.uni-mainz.de> <4x1uqv4pbx.fsf_-_@fencepost.gnu.org> <056566D61BA5441E860782777E736F44@us.oracle.com> <4F18A26A.1020402@cs.ucla.edu> <20120120074922.GA3095@acm.acm> <4F1929BA.7020004@cs.ucla.edu> <838vl24thl.fsf@gnu.org> <4F19E7FC.40301@cs.ucla.edu> <20120121085905.GA3075@acm.acm> <83sjj92vsi.fsf@gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: dough.gmane.org 1327144367 12426 80.91.229.12 (21 Jan 2012 11:12:47 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@dough.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2012 11:12:47 +0000 (UTC) Cc: ulm@gentoo.org, eggert@cs.ucla.edu, drew.adams@oracle.com, emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Sat Jan 21 12:12:42 2012 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([140.186.70.17]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.69) (envelope-from ) id 1RoYsD-0003SM-CN for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 21 Jan 2012 12:12:41 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([::1]:40754 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1RoYsC-0006oU-HJ for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sat, 21 Jan 2012 06:12:40 -0500 Original-Received: from eggs.gnu.org ([140.186.70.92]:44950) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1RoYsA-0006oC-Bt for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 21 Jan 2012 06:12:39 -0500 Original-Received: from Debian-exim by eggs.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1RoYs9-0003qv-Bn for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 21 Jan 2012 06:12:38 -0500 Original-Received: from colin.muc.de ([193.149.48.1]:28074 helo=mail.muc.de) by eggs.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.71) (envelope-from ) id 1RoYs9-0003qV-3I for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sat, 21 Jan 2012 06:12:37 -0500 Original-Received: (qmail 88931 invoked by uid 3782); 21 Jan 2012 11:12:31 -0000 Original-Received: from acm.muc.de (pD9519E74.dip.t-dialin.net [217.81.158.116]) by colin.muc.de (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Sat, 21 Jan 2012 12:12:28 +0100 Original-Received: (qmail 2785 invoked by uid 1000); 21 Jan 2012 11:12:38 -0000 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <83sjj92vsi.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/1.1.12 (Macallan) X-Primary-Address: acm@muc.de X-detected-operating-system: by eggs.gnu.org: Genre and OS details not recognized. X-Received-From: 193.149.48.1 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.14 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:147812 Archived-At: On Sat, Jan 21, 2012 at 12:29:33PM +0200, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > > Date: Sat, 21 Jan 2012 08:59:05 +0000 > > Cc: Eli Zaretskii , ulm@gentoo.org, drew.adams@oracle.com, > > emacs-devel@gnu.org > > From: Alan Mackenzie > > Sorry, but that's a philosophical point that cannot pass without > > challenge. Because fewer people are using tty environments (which is > > basically what is meant here by "ASCII-only") is it really "less > > important" to support them? Or is there some other reason? > > There are at least three Emacs developers who use a tty rather than a > > GUI. There are users who do the same. (Why use a GUI for pure text > > work, indeed?) To adapt a tty for random Unicode characters is a > > non-trivial amount of work. > TTY != pure-ASCII. Yes, OK. But they share some of the problems WRT curly quote marks. > What kind of TTY do you use that needs a "non-trivial amount of work" > to support non-ASCII characters? And what that is the work which > needs to be done for that? I have an ordinary Linux tty, currently running a Latin-1 character set. I'd need somehow to arrange for the quotes to be added to that set. I don't know of any character set which includes both of these (I've had a look through /usr/share/consolefonts/). I don't know how to do this, and finding out is going to be a lot of work. Also, there's the issue of adapting the keyboard to support the new characters. I know how to do this, so it's no big deal for me. But for the vast majority of tty users, I'd guess this is another research project. -- Alan Mackenzie (Nuremberg, Germany).