From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: news.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Alan Mackenzie Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Documentation of transient-mark-mode is sloppy, wrong, and confused. Date: Fri, 29 May 2009 09:27:09 +0000 Message-ID: <20090529092709.GB2793@muc.de> References: <20090528122927.GA2175@muc.de> <87fxepf9s8.fsf@cyd.mit.edu> <20090528201529.GA4605@muc.de> <87bppdx8c0.fsf@cyd.mit.edu> <20090528230359.GA1474@muc.de> <83zlcwqp89.fsf@gnu.org> NNTP-Posting-Host: lo.gmane.org Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii X-Trace: ger.gmane.org 1243589197 12597 80.91.229.12 (29 May 2009 09:26:37 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@ger.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 29 May 2009 09:26:37 +0000 (UTC) Cc: cyd@stupidchicken.com, Stefan Monnier , emacs-devel@gnu.org To: Eli Zaretskii Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Fri May 29 11:26:33 2009 Return-path: Envelope-to: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by lo.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.50) id 1M9yMC-0002wW-8Y for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 29 May 2009 11:26:32 +0200 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1]:43638 helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1M9yMB-0000qK-G6 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Fri, 29 May 2009 05:26:31 -0400 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1M9yM3-0000nA-Su for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 29 May 2009 05:26:23 -0400 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1M9yLy-0000eZ-8z for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 29 May 2009 05:26:22 -0400 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (port=52450 helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1M9yLx-0000dT-RV for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 29 May 2009 05:26:17 -0400 Original-Received: from colin.muc.de ([193.149.48.1]:3957 helo=mail.muc.de) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtps (TLS-1.0:DHE_RSA_AES_256_CBC_SHA1:32) (Exim 4.60) (envelope-from ) id 1M9yLx-0000bW-8B for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Fri, 29 May 2009 05:26:17 -0400 Original-Received: (qmail 39112 invoked by uid 3782); 29 May 2009 09:26:15 -0000 Original-Received: from acm.muc.de (pD9E514E9.dip.t-dialin.net [217.229.20.233]) by colin2.muc.de (tmda-ofmipd) with ESMTP; Fri, 29 May 2009 11:26:12 +0200 Original-Received: (qmail 3975 invoked by uid 1000); 29 May 2009 09:27:09 -0000 Content-Disposition: inline In-Reply-To: <83zlcwqp89.fsf@gnu.org> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.9i X-Delivery-Agent: TMDA/1.1.5 (Fettercairn) X-Primary-Address: acm@muc.de X-detected-operating-system: by monty-python.gnu.org: FreeBSD 4.6-4.9 X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: news.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:111187 Archived-At: Hi, Eli! On Fri, May 29, 2009 at 11:37:26AM +0300, Eli Zaretskii wrote: > > From: Stefan Monnier > > Date: Thu, 28 May 2009 21:55:51 -0400 > > Cc: Chong Yidong , emacs-devel@gnu.org > > > I think the answer has got to be along the following lines: "The region > > > is called @dfn{active} when Emacs marks it internally as the portion of > > > buffer which any of a certain set of commands is to work on, when > > > otherwise the command would use the whole buffer, or a single word, or > > > some other portion of buffer. When the region is active, the mark is > > > also said to be @dfn{active}." - essentially the (iii) from my previous > > > email. Sorry for the poor wording - it's late and I'm tired. > > I would find this fairly confusing > So would I. If you read this text carefully, it actually says > something like "the region is active when Emacs marks it as active." > That's hardly a definition of what "active" is. Well, it's just as good as anybody else has come up with, so far! But the criticism isn't quite fair. My definition says "a region is active, when it will make itself the object manipulated by any of the commands `replace-string', `how-many', `keep-lines', `undo', `ispell-word', `ispell', `Mouse-3', `indent-for-tab-command', `fill-paragraph', `sgml-tag', , `set-justification-left/right/center/full/none', `comment-dwim', , , `keyboard-quit'". At least, it would have done if I'd've been wide enough awake. Do you agree or disagree with me that this is what "active" means, regardless of my clumsy way of saying it? If you disagree, what do think "active" actually does mean? -- Alan Mackenzie (Nuremberg, Germany).