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From: Luc Teirlinck <teirllm@dms.auburn.edu>
Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org, rms@gnu.org, drew.adams@oracle.com, storm@cua.dk
Subject: Re: Customize buttons that change user's custom fileshouldaskforconfirmation
Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2005 19:28:40 -0600 (CST)	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <200502190128.j1J1SeW23731@raven.dms.auburn.edu> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <02e501c51613$f44724a0$0200a8c0@sedrcw11488> (lennart.borgman.073@student.lu.se)

I lost the CC's im my original reply to Lennart:

Lennart Borgman wrote:

   I agree with your points, but is not this the case with most options
   dialoges? I myself have often found that I have lost track of what I am
   doing in those dialoges in other applications. To be sure to avoid trouble I
   then hit Cancel and start it over again.

You mean that each time I have to set an option in Custom, I would
have to first enter a key sequence or hit a button in a header line to
cancel all previous edits, then I set my value as I do now, then I hit
another key sequence or click another button in the header line to
save it?  This does not appear to be a simplification of the current
situation to me.  I believe it would be very easy to occasionally
forget the first step.

How are you going to reset the value to standard, with the new design?
One definitely wants to reset a single option to standard, not
everything in the buffer.  Being able to easily set an option back to
standard is important to everybody, but especially to novices.  It
seem that you will still need the individual State buttons, even with
the new design.

It all looks like a completely unnecessary complication of things.
People are inevitably going to give up on the first step in the
tedious three step sequence and, inevitably, they are going to sooner
or later get burned by that.

If one really would want to get rid of the State buttons (which the
new design can not do), one could replace the individual State buttons
with individual rows of four buttons:

SAVE || RESET TO SAVED ||  RESET TO STANDARD || ADVANCED

where ADVANCED would contain the remainder of the current options
listed in State, that is, ADVANCED would still work like the current
STATE, but can be ignored unless needed.  RESET TO SAVED and RESET TO
STANDARD are an important rescue tool if you messed up.

The only argument I have yet seen against single option buttons is
that people are not used to it.  It does not take a gigantic mental
effort to get used to it, and it makes things a lot simpler and a lot
less error prone.

If Custom is hard to understand for other reasons, we could worry
about those.  But to me, it seems ridiculous to claim that single
option buttons are a difficult to grasp concept.

Sincerely,

Luc.

  parent reply	other threads:[~2005-02-19  1:28 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 148+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
     [not found] <DNEMKBNJBGPAOPIJOOICKENMCAAA.drew.adams@oracle.com>
2005-01-31  0:20 ` Customize buttons that change user's custom file should ask forconfirmation Richard Stallman
2005-01-31  1:07   ` Stefan Monnier
2005-01-31  2:02     ` Miles Bader
2005-01-31  1:16   ` Customize buttons that change user's custom file should askforconfirmation Lennart Borgman
2005-01-31  1:55     ` Miles Bader
2005-01-31  2:06     ` Drew Adams
2005-01-31 15:21     ` Per Abrahamsen
2005-01-31 17:22       ` Drew Adams
2005-01-31 21:39         ` Robert J. Chassell
2005-01-31 22:37           ` Customize buttons that change user's custom file shouldaskforconfirmation Drew Adams
2005-01-31 22:59           ` Customize buttons that change user's custom file should askforconfirmation Kim F. Storm
2005-01-31 23:50             ` Stefan Monnier
2005-02-01  0:44               ` Simon Josefsson
2005-01-31 23:56             ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-01  8:56               ` Per Abrahamsen
2005-02-01 14:11                 ` Robert J. Chassell
2005-02-01 16:21                   ` Drew Adams
2005-02-02  7:27         ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-02 18:01           ` Customize buttons that change user's custom file shouldaskforconfirmation Drew Adams
2005-02-02 18:46             ` Stefan Monnier
2005-02-02 19:02               ` Drew Adams
2005-02-03  2:43                 ` Miles Bader
2005-02-03  6:58                   ` Customize buttons that change user's custom fileshouldaskforconfirmation Lennart Borgman
2005-02-03  7:39                     ` Miles Bader
2005-02-03  9:36                       ` Kim F. Storm
2005-02-03 14:46                         ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-03 15:18                           ` David Kastrup
2005-02-03 15:30                             ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-03 19:30                         ` Drew Adams
2005-02-03 19:54                           ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-03 20:05                             ` Drew Adams
2005-02-03 20:13                               ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-03 20:18                                 ` Customize buttons that change user's customfileshouldaskforconfirmation Drew Adams
2005-02-03 20:23                                   ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-04 10:22                             ` Customize buttons that change user's custom fileshouldaskforconfirmation Kim F. Storm
2005-02-07  5:32                               ` Drew Adams
2005-02-07  7:25                                 ` Customize buttons that change user's customfileshouldaskforconfirmation Lennart Borgman
2005-02-07  7:34                                   ` Drew Adams
2005-02-07 17:28                                     ` Customize buttons that change user'scustomfileshouldaskforconfirmation Drew Adams
2005-02-07 20:23                                       ` Robert J. Chassell
2005-02-07 20:26                                       ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-08 11:46                                         ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-07 13:45                                   ` Customize buttons that change user's customfileshouldaskforconfirmation Robert J. Chassell
2005-02-07 16:46                                     ` Customize buttons that change user'scustomfileshouldaskforconfirmation Lennart Borgman
2005-02-07 14:15                                   ` Customize buttons that change user's customfileshouldaskforconfirmation Robert J. Chassell
2005-02-07 16:23                                     ` Customize buttons that change user'scustomfileshouldaskforconfirmation Lennart Borgman
2005-02-07 20:22                                       ` Robert J. Chassell
2005-02-07 20:29                                         ` Customize buttons that changeuser'scustomfileshouldaskforconfirmation Lennart Borgman
2005-02-08 11:46                                           ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-09  8:11                                     ` Customize buttons that change user's customfileshouldaskforconfirmation Richard Stallman
2005-02-09 13:29                                       ` Robert J. Chassell
2005-02-07 15:07                                   ` Customize buttons that change user's customfiles Robert J. Chassell
2005-02-07 15:53                                     ` Robert J. Chassell
2005-02-09  8:11                                 ` Customize buttons that change user's custom fileshouldaskforconfirmation Richard Stallman
2005-02-09 13:31                                   ` Robert J. Chassell
2005-02-09 17:27                                     ` Customize buttons that change user's customfileshouldaskforconfirmation Drew Adams
2005-02-09 20:31                                       ` Robert J. Chassell
2005-02-09 21:27                                         ` Customize buttons that change user'scustomfileshouldaskforconfirmation Drew Adams
2005-02-10 14:42                                           ` Robert J. Chassell
2005-02-10 15:20                                             ` Kim F. Storm
2005-02-11 21:12                                             ` Customize buttons that changeuser'scustomfileshouldaskforconfirmation Drew Adams
2005-02-09 14:12                                   ` Customize buttons that change user's customfileshouldaskforconfirmation Lennart Borgman
2005-02-09 17:17                                     ` Drew Adams
2005-02-10 18:39                                     ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-10 21:56                                       ` Kim F. Storm
2005-02-11 21:13                                         ` Drew Adams
2005-02-12 14:27                                           ` Kim F. Storm
2005-02-12 18:04                                             ` Drew Adams
2005-02-12 18:45                                               ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-12 21:01                                                 ` Customize buttons that change user'scustomfileshouldaskforconfirmation Lennart Borgman
2005-02-12 21:21                                                   ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-12 21:28                                                     ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-12 21:42                                                       ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-13  0:17                                                         ` Customize buttons that changeuser'scustomfileshouldaskforconfirmation Lennart Borgman
2005-02-13  0:54                                                           ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-13  4:13                                                           ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-14  2:25                                                             ` Customize buttons thatchangeuser'scustomfileshouldaskforconfirmation Drew Adams
2005-02-13  4:32                                                           ` Customize buttons that changeuser'scustomfileshouldaskforconfirmation Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-14  2:07                                                 ` Customize buttons that change user'scustomfileshouldaskforconfirmation Drew Adams
2005-02-14  2:21                                                   ` Drew Adams
2005-02-14  3:32                                                   ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-12 19:03                                               ` Customize buttons that change user's customfileshouldaskforconfirmation Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-12 19:21                                               ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-12 20:09                                               ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-12  8:37                                         ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-12  9:14                                           ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-12 11:48                                           ` Robert J. Chassell
2005-02-12 14:58                                             ` Kim F. Storm
2005-02-07 20:51                           ` Customize buttons that change user's custom fileshouldaskforconfirmation Richard Stallman
2005-02-08 20:37                             ` Customize buttons that change user's customfileshouldaskforconfirmation Drew Adams
2005-02-15  6:18                         ` Customize buttons that change user's custom fileshouldaskforconfirmation Richard Stallman
2005-02-15  7:05                           ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-16  9:32                             ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-16 13:07                               ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-16 14:44                                 ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-16 17:14                                   ` Customize buttons that change user's customfileshouldaskforconfirmation Lennart Borgman
2005-02-16 23:07                                     ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-15 17:51                           ` Customize buttons that change user's custom fileshouldaskforconfirmation Drew Adams
2005-02-15 18:33                             ` Drew Adams
2005-02-15 19:14                               ` Customize buttons that change user's customfileshouldaskforconfirmation Lennart Borgman
2005-02-15 19:51                                 ` Drew Adams
2005-02-16  7:25                                   ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-17 10:34                             ` Customize buttons that change user's custom fileshouldaskforconfirmation Richard Stallman
2005-02-15 23:20                           ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-16  0:03                             ` Kim F. Storm
2005-02-16  0:56                               ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-17 10:35                             ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-17 12:44                               ` Kim F. Storm
     [not found]                                 ` <003e01c51506$35ecb6e0$0200a8c0@sedrcw11488>
     [not found]                                   ` <m3oeejyxd6.fsf@kfs-l.imdomain.dk>
2005-02-17 17:27                                     ` David Kastrup
2005-02-17 18:32                                     ` Drew Adams
2005-02-17 20:33                                       ` Kim F. Storm
2005-02-17 23:06                                         ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-17 22:57                                 ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-18  8:23                                   ` Kim F. Storm
2005-02-18 13:54                                     ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-18 14:12                                     ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-18 14:56                                       ` Kim F. Storm
2005-02-18 22:59                                         ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-18 23:29                                           ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-18 23:45                                             ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-19  1:16                                               ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-19  1:28                                               ` Luc Teirlinck [this message]
2005-02-19  3:10                                               ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-19 21:32                                                 ` Kim F. Storm
2005-02-19 20:55                                           ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-19 21:24                                           ` Kim F. Storm
2005-02-20  2:31                                             ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-19 20:54                                         ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-20  8:52                                           ` Lennart Borgman
2005-02-20 17:09                                             ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-20 19:24                                               ` Kim F. Storm
2005-02-20 20:18                                                 ` David Kastrup
2005-02-20 20:46                                                   ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-21  1:00                                                 ` Drew Adams
2005-02-20 17:17                                             ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-19  9:44                                       ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-19 15:42                                         ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-19  9:44                                     ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-17 18:34                               ` Drew Adams
2005-02-18 14:13                                 ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-18 15:17                                   ` Customize buttons that change user's customfileshouldaskforconfirmation Drew Adams
2005-02-19  3:51                                     ` Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-16  0:37                           ` Customize buttons that change user's custom fileshouldaskforconfirmation Luc Teirlinck
2005-02-17 10:35                             ` Richard Stallman
2005-02-03 19:13                 ` Customize buttons that change user's custom file shouldaskforconfirmation Richard Stallman
2005-02-01 13:30     ` Customize buttons that change user's custom file should askforconfirmation Richard Stallman
2005-01-31  1:22   ` Customize buttons that change user's custom file should ask forconfirmation Miles Bader
2005-02-01 13:30     ` Richard Stallman

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