From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Luc Teirlinck Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Eliminating "changed in Emacs outside of Customize" Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2005 16:08:23 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <200502032208.j13M8Nw02099@raven.dms.auburn.edu> References: NNTP-Posting-Host: main.gmane.org X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1107468747 15683 80.91.229.2 (3 Feb 2005 22:12:27 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 3 Feb 2005 22:12:27 +0000 (UTC) Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org, rms@gnu.org, monnier@iro.umontreal.ca, abraham@dina.kvl.dk Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Thu Feb 03 23:12:27 2005 Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by ciao.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1CwpD3-0004Jd-TW for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 03 Feb 2005 23:12:22 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1CwpQQ-000140-Mj for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Thu, 03 Feb 2005 17:26:10 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1CwpOc-0000G9-TW for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 03 Feb 2005 17:24:19 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.43) id 1CwpOa-0000EG-Pc for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 03 Feb 2005 17:24:17 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.43) id 1CwpOa-0000E6-L8 for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Thu, 03 Feb 2005 17:24:16 -0500 Original-Received: from [131.204.53.104] (helo=manatee.dms.auburn.edu) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1CwpAX-00034R-TE; Thu, 03 Feb 2005 17:09:46 -0500 Original-Received: from raven.dms.auburn.edu (raven.dms.auburn.edu [131.204.53.29]) by manatee.dms.auburn.edu (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id j13M9e9N023941; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 16:09:41 -0600 (CST) Original-Received: (from teirllm@localhost) by raven.dms.auburn.edu (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.11.7) id j13M8Nw02099; Thu, 3 Feb 2005 16:08:23 -0600 (CST) X-Authentication-Warning: raven.dms.auburn.edu: teirllm set sender to teirllm@dms.auburn.edu using -f Original-To: drew.adams@oracle.com In-reply-to: X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org X-MailScanner-To: ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:32848 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel:32848 Drew Adams wrote: The question is about the _UI_ only. Does it help users or get in their way to have such a distinction in the UI? Very definitely. I like to get accurate information, not false and misleading information. "Set for the current session" means that the option is only set for the current session. It will not be set anymore if you start another session. If I see it were I do not expect it, I know that I inadvertently released my mouse at the wrong place or entered the wrong number if I used the keyboard. (I actually have had that happen several times.) That problem needs to be corrected and it is trivial to do so. "Changed outside Custom" means something very different. It means that it was changed outside Custom. Maybe it was just set for the current session and will not be there anymore if I start another session, maybe it will be set every session. There is no way for Custom to figure it out. The conclusion to be drawn out of that is that trying to save a value through Custom may not work properly. I argue that it is clearer for users without such a distinction. Not for this user, that is for sure. I rely heavily on the distinction. I can not see what is "clear" about identifying to things that have not the slightest thing to do with each other. This is not broken. Let us not break it. Sincerely, Luc.