From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Path: main.gmane.org!not-for-mail From: Luc Teirlinck Newsgroups: gmane.emacs.devel Subject: Re: Usage of FOR-RELEASE [WAS: Deliberate breaking of bootstrapping in locals.texi; WAS: Bootstrap failure; WAS: Can not build lispref info] Date: Sun, 5 Dec 2004 20:19:55 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <200412060219.iB62JtD15066@raven.dms.auburn.edu> References: <41B36A49.8060400@math.ku.dk> NNTP-Posting-Host: deer.gmane.org X-Trace: sea.gmane.org 1102299729 32525 80.91.229.6 (6 Dec 2004 02:22:09 GMT) X-Complaints-To: usenet@sea.gmane.org NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 6 Dec 2004 02:22:09 +0000 (UTC) Cc: larsh@math.ku.dk, emacs-devel@gnu.org Original-X-From: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Mon Dec 06 03:22:05 2004 Return-path: Original-Received: from lists.gnu.org ([199.232.76.165]) by deer.gmane.org with esmtp (Exim 3.35 #1 (Debian)) id 1Cb8Vo-0005hv-00 for ; Mon, 06 Dec 2004 03:22:04 +0100 Original-Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=lists.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1Cb8fX-0005dr-H7 for ged-emacs-devel@m.gmane.org; Sun, 05 Dec 2004 21:32:07 -0500 Original-Received: from mailman by lists.gnu.org with tmda-scanned (Exim 4.33) id 1Cb8fF-0005cv-Mu for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 05 Dec 2004 21:31:49 -0500 Original-Received: from exim by lists.gnu.org with spam-scanned (Exim 4.33) id 1Cb8fE-0005cU-SJ for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 05 Dec 2004 21:31:49 -0500 Original-Received: from [199.232.76.173] (helo=monty-python.gnu.org) by lists.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.33) id 1Cb8fE-0005cB-MG for emacs-devel@gnu.org; Sun, 05 Dec 2004 21:31:48 -0500 Original-Received: from [131.204.53.104] (helo=manatee.dms.auburn.edu) by monty-python.gnu.org with esmtp (Exim 4.34) id 1Cb8VM-00043N-Ju; Sun, 05 Dec 2004 21:21:36 -0500 Original-Received: from raven.dms.auburn.edu (raven.dms.auburn.edu [131.204.53.29]) by manatee.dms.auburn.edu (8.12.10/8.12.10) with ESMTP id iB62LZFu023329; Sun, 5 Dec 2004 20:21:36 -0600 (CST) Original-Received: (from teirllm@localhost) by raven.dms.auburn.edu (8.11.7p1+Sun/8.11.7) id iB62JtD15066; Sun, 5 Dec 2004 20:19:55 -0600 (CST) X-Authentication-Warning: raven.dms.auburn.edu: teirllm set sender to teirllm@dms.auburn.edu using -f Original-To: rms@gnu.org In-reply-to: (message from Richard Stallman on Sun, 05 Dec 2004 20:40:33 -0500) X-BeenThere: emacs-devel@gnu.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.5 Precedence: list List-Id: "Emacs development discussions." List-Unsubscribe: , List-Archive: List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Original-Sender: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Errors-To: emacs-devel-bounces+ged-emacs-devel=m.gmane.org@gnu.org Xref: main.gmane.org gmane.emacs.devel:30741 X-Report-Spam: http://spam.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.devel:30741 Richard Stallman wrote: I installed the fix so that problems building manuals won't make a build fail. I thought I had installed it before. Yes, but building the Elisp manual still fails, without telling the user anything about it. (I doubt that many users will notice the error messages flashing by on the screen buried among tons of other error messages.) I just bootstrapped with your new changes. Changes made by me or others to the Elisp manuals got ignored, because the Elisp manual did not get rebuilt. This without any notice. We ask people to check the manuals. The least we can do is provide them with up to date versions of the manuals. I don't mind using FOR-RELEASE to record these things, but it is ridiculous to argue that there's something wrong with xrefs to nowhere, merely because the build setup doesn't handle them right. But that is not what we are arguing. There is something wrong with xrefs that point nowhere, _at present_, until it is _really_ fixed, because it wastes the time of many people by misleading them into believing that they are using an updated version of the Elisp manual. So I have started to fix it. But you have not finished fixing it. Unless things are going to be really fixed in matter of one day or so, I propose to comment out those xrefs again, so people's time will no longer be wasted. Sincerely, Luc.